Holden/Ford - what's all that about?

[Nick Short]

Hi, I'm a Pommy enthusiast of Aussie V8s (model and full-size), and I can see from these pages that some people's opinions are quite strongly split either for or against Holden or Ford, even where we're talking about models. What's all that about? Do some people really not see how good a piece of engineering or motorsport history a car is simply because of the badge on the front? I'm not trying to provoke angry rantings - it's just as a Pom I don't get it! I have an XC Cobra here in the UK, and I love it, as well as many other V8 Fords, but I also think that many of the competition-derived Holdens are awesome, irrespective of who made them. Maybe one day I'll understand, but I hope not! Reasoned responses please.......

[Aussiecollector]

Nick,

Its in our breeding, passed down from Father to son and so on.

No seriously, its mainly due to the fact that these are the main breed of cars in Aus for most of us 30 somethings we proberly were driven around in either one of them, learn't to drive one of them and now own 1 or 2 of them. I have had Holden breeding but have had Fords in my garage (company cars) the first was a laser and I finished with a Fairmont. Now I own my own company and the breeding has kicked back in and we have Holdens. The thing I love about us Aussies is that we are very one eyed when it comes to cars, sporting teams and states. Man you should see the arguments at parties about what state (city) is better especially the (Melbourne - Sydney thing) being ex Melb now based in Sydney even after 8 years I still get the same old taunts. Its all part of being Australian, we love the place, the teams we support and the cars that we own.

Cheers Glenn
The Holden, Mclaren F1, HRT V8Supercar, Melbourne Storm 99 World Champs (Rugby League), Melbourne/Sydney lover

[SmartyMarty]

Hahaha...well...as a german i was wondering about that "fight" too...i m happy im not crazy about a single brand..there are so many good cars...i ll have the chance to check out the ozzie mentality when i move to oz in november...I ll buy a Holden AND a Ford flag when i go to races....hope that doesen t mean to get beaten up by both parties ;-)

[ET351]

Nick,

I have to apologise for Glenn, he's from Melbourne, so he can't help it:D

But seriously, he's pretty much on the mark. It's like the poms and the soccer (sorry, football). It's almost like a religion who you follow, instilled from generation to generation, or ignited by a hero who fuelled the passion.
For me, it was Allan Moffat, the XY's and Ford all the way. It helps if your older brother has a Violet XA GT!

In the '70's me and my mates would have real big arguments over Brock v Moffat. Of course now I'm more mature (yes, in my '30's but still collecting model cars... is that an oxymoron??) I can see the talent Brock had (still has)
as well.

Yes, we're a weird mob, but we wouldn't have it any other way, Ford or Holden fans!

Cheers, Tony
Ford fanatic, Ferrari F1 admirer, DJR V8Supercars (c'mon guys!), diehard (and masochistic) Cronulla Sharks supporter, and resident of Sydney (the best city in Oz), NSW (best state in Oz), Australia (best country in the World!)

[Oh Five]

Howdy smarty marty, one piece of advice, dont walk around Mcphillamy Park, Bathurst with your holden and ford flags around you, that wouldnt be very "smarty Marty" !!!!!!!!!!!!
Cheers.:)

[Nick Short]

Thanks guys, it is starting to "make sense" (although not in a logical way!). The football analogy is probably right - here in the UK my mate is a sensible enough bloke, but at a match he hates anyone supporting the oppoes. I never got into that, so I suppose it didn't get ingrained as I grew up.

Well I've got Holden and Ford models from Biante (side by side as well....), despite being a member of the Falcon Cobra Club of Australia, but they haven't threatened to expel me yet! I think it's just that coming from a country of dull Euro-boxes, I love any competition-derived Aussie cars, irrespective of manufacturer. Bloody Poms, eh? Always sitting on the fence......

[Bangkok Bob]

Hi Nick and Marty

The other guys have it pretty much right. The Ford/Holden thing does start at a very young age.

As a Ford fan, it was an interesting experience for me that my first car was a Holden (an EK), after that I went on to own a HQ Holden Panelvan, a V8 Holden Torana and a few Datsuns. eventually I owned an XY Falcon and the an XF Falcon (finally driving a Ford).

Anyway, the history of my car ownership taught me that both the Holdens and Fords had different qualities about them. The older Holdens are incredibly easy to repair (when you do it yourself) compared to the Fords but for me, I enjoyed the ride of the Ford's more (just a shame they tended to have a whole bunch of extra junk under the bonnet to confuse things...particularly the XF which just doesn't match the piccies in the workshop manual). There was a TV program made in Australia called Bush Mechanics which was about some aboriginals in the Desert and how they repair cars with whatever is around. Anyway, the echo the same sentiment, they like the ride of the Ford but hate trying to fix it. Nowadays, I am sure it is much of a muchness and they all need to go soemwhere for repairs.

I guess the Ford thing really started for me when I was young, we had a Ford, then my Dad started selling Fords (he did go on to sell Holdens later in life), and for the whole time I knew him, My grandfather always had Falcons. I was a fan of Moffat at Bathurst, and later Johnson, when Moffat went to the Rice Burners).

For the diehard Ford fan it is like some of the bumper stickers say...'I'd rather push my Ford than drive a Holden' (you can get this sticker the other way around too).

I would actually own an older Holden anyday (like a Torana or an old HQ Premier) but reckon I'd still own a Ford at the same time. After driving Falcons for a few years now, I think I know what my grandfather saw in them.

So the battle goes on, each side geting frustrated when they come up against a particularly obnoxious opposing fan.

Bob

[Bangkok Bob]

Oh yeah, forgot to mention the Sydney-Melbourne (which one is better) argument is quickly diffused when someone like me shows up and says he is from Canberra. The Sydneysider and Melbournite, wil join forces and attack the Canberran instead. All of Australia hates Canberra (except Canberrans)!

[mustang1966]

Bob naw mate. I prefer people from Canberra. It's Victorians and Queenlanders we in NSW hate :)

For mind I think it is taste. I come from a family of GM/Chev/Holden lovers, and I am the odd sheep. It's FORD all the way for me but I have owned on Commodore, a VL and it was a good car. I would also own a A9X hatch any day of the week.

Look at the history of FORD, both here in Australia and world wide. Here in Aust we had the GT's, the mighty HO's, XD/XE ESP's. The states had the mighty Shelby Mustangs, GT-40, Shelby Cobras. The list goes on and on.

On the most part it is light hearted fun, but you still get the odd moron who cant see past a badge.

Cheers Mark
Ford lover, Mustang lover, GT/GS Falcon lover, Ducati ohhhhh baby, Dicky is a GOD, DJR rule forever, Stone Brothers a close second.

[SmartyMarty]

:p Hahaha...jesus i love ozzies...:p

[Nick Short]

I can understand people having a preference, based on their experiences, and I'm glad to see that it seems fairly light-hearted with most people. I was looking at a website a few days ago, and there were some really venomous (and pretty illiterate) hate messages posted, against either Ford or Holden. I'm pleased that nobody has threatened to burn my house down or rearrange my features for owning a Falcon. I suppose it is a long way for Aussies to come just for that, and Poms don't know any better, so I'm pretty safe here!

Keeping it tied in with model collecting, I notice that many of the Aussie model collections featured on the web seem to have cars from both manufacturers happily in the same cabinet, so it must be a minority of idiots who take things so seriously.....

[Bangkok Bob]

Thanks Mark, it is good to know we aren't everyones enemy. I think the Queenslander theory extends to everywhere in Aus (except QLD). There is the common perspective that if Australia was ever to split up, QLD would be the first to form its own country.

On the model front, i do actually collect both, altohugh I tend to favour Fords (I am more interested in the Holdens from the seventies, but all Fords appeal to me).

You are right Nick, it is only a minority, but unfortunately, it can sometimes lead to things being thrown at your car etc...this is fairly rare, maybe just on 'special' days like when Bathurst is on (and there are contingents all around the country getting a bit rowdy). A bit like Soccer Hooligans I guess?

[V8SS]

Nick
We pretty much have the same culture here in NZ and anyone who was at the Pukekohe round of the V8 supercars will testify that there is a definite rivalry here. I'm afraid I must be in the minority and can never see any Ford models being added to my collection though I must admit that I was impressed with the Tru Blu Falcon and think the Green Eyed Monster is the best looking Falcon racing today.
What I would like to know though Nick is what sort of reaction do you get from the Brits when you drive around the UK in your XC Cobra?Its not exactly the most inconspicuous car on the road and slightly bigger than your average European hatch. Your petrol bill must be a nightmare as well.

[Damian]

What happens though when the person you follow in the V8 SUPERCARS jump ship to the dark side? I
followed Lowndes and love holden, but when he announced he going to FORD what do you do?
I unfortunately sort of jumped ship as well.
I still follow Lowndes but support Holden.
Typical fence sitter.
I think the same with Ingall supporters. maybe.
The BIGGEST mistake ford made was when they decided to stop making the V8 engine in 85'.
I don't think alot of people forgiven them for that small brain explosion.

[V8SS]

I guess it comes down to each individuals passion for motorsport. I always thought that I would follow the progress of Craig Lowndes after the switch but as soon as he started driving that Ford, he was the enemy. I'm also a huge Russell Ingall fan and have all the Ingall models issued by CC and also the silver Autoart 1:18th Castrol car as well. I'll be getting the latest CC Ingall car in 1:43rd which will probably be my last if he goes to Ford.
Everyone is different but it comes back to the Ford/Holden thing.

[BATHURSTFAN]

I think most people understand that most of the drivers will drive just about anything - it their business. The same as footballers, they'll go where it suits them best and where the dollars are.

The bottom line is that I enjoy the sport. I'm a Ford supporter, but i collect any model if they appeal to me, be it a Ford or a Holden.

Same with the drivers, these days they could end up driving with any team so I don't begrudge any driver that swaps marques, after all it is his living.

All of the great drivers like Brock, Perkins, Johnson and Moffat have driven for "the other side" at some time. So I don't see why Lowndes should not be forgiven.

Question for Smarty Marty, what state are you going to live in ?
:D

[Nick Short]

Hi V8SS, being on a different side of the planet I'm asleep when all you guys are posting, so I missed replying straight away! As for the Cobra, the general reaction is a sort of Exorcist swivelling of the head! It's not just the sheer size of the thing compared to your average Euro car, but the big stripes that seem to intimidate some people when they see it in their mirrors. At busy junctions though, people just wave me through with a smile, which I don't get in my normal car! We have a lot of teenage boy racers locally, all in little Corsas and Ford Fiestas with huge 200kg body kits, trying to make them look like space ships or Ferrari Testarossas, and their little faces fall when they see the Cobra, because they realise they're no longer Top Dog......With fuel running at over A$2 a litre I have to drive like my grandmother a lot of the time, but I did fit a smaller 600cfm Holley prior to bringing it over here, to try and ease the consumption (it was on a huge double pumper and doing 5 mpg driven hard!). Lots of fun just cruising and listening to the V8 rumble bouncing off the houses.........

[SmartyMarty]

@Bathurstfan


In the one and only absolutely best and most exciting state of Australia...Geelong/Victoria ;)

[terrine]

victoria?????
....no wonder you guys never won the war...lol
it is unfortunate (or fortunate?) that the majority of ozzies live in in the southeast corner and they believe the world begins at melb and finishes at syd, but i am sure if you ever venture to the far north you will be more than excited. ..many of our happy visitors are swiss/german/austrian....driving falcons of course

[SmartyMarty]

@terrine

when im there i d love to travell around a bit...i havent seen very much of australia yet...hopefully i ll get to see a bit more( in a Falcon of course ;) )

[Aussiecollector]

Smarty you not wrong about Geelong, Mate I was posted there for 3 years before being sent to Sydney and I had the time of my life. Business wise it was great we had the contract at the military air base (Avalon - Now privately owned by a very rich car enthusiast). Being onsite when the Pigs were doing test flights was great I love cars but the horse power of the fighter jets was incredible.

Glenn

[SmartyMarty]

Glen

:) Been at the Avalon race way twice and saw my first dirt track races there... was very exciting...never seen an oval race before..will be great to live close to that place..i ve seen some big jets crossing the road to Melbourne too...was pretty impressing to see them prepare for landing...i love that area...unfortunately its pretty damn cold in winter...i thought it will never be colder than 25 C in oz:rolleyes:


PS:What was that thread about???

[Oh Five]

Geelong???
i came 1st in a raffle once it was 1 weeks holiday in Geelong, i'm glad i didnt get 2nd prize, cos it was 2 WEEKS!!!!!!!!!:D