Do we really need a Forum Posts Poll?

[drof]

We are all just Human, we make mistakes, we say things that we don't really mean, we get hot under the collar and start shooting from the hips, we engage our mouths first instead of our brains, please Lord forgive us. We are just passionate about our beliefs, sometimes to much and we say things we regret.
I for one will put up my hand and say of late I have engaged in substanard post replies,for this I am truely SORRY, wether I was taunted into it or not, I should have not replied. Everyone will agree how passionate we are about Diecast Cars but even more passionate about the Brand we choose; Ford or Holden, so where do we draw a line at what we can and can't say, it's simple, treat others how you would want to be treated yourself.

I don't think that a Thread like a Forum Posts Poll is the answer because taking history into account we have been there and done that topic before and we are good for a little while but new members come along and don't know this, and before long the vicious cycle starts again.

There is no easy answer what to do about this problem because as I said we are all Human and we are all different in every way and every viewpoint. At the end of the day we all just have to get along with each other and do the best we can. Freedom of speech is a powerful tool if it is used in the right way.
Without going on and on, a solution to this problem is only attainable by the peolple that write these threads, and I for one will solemly swear to read and read each post and to think about my reply before putting fingers to keyboard, how about the rest of you!!
Lastly my biggest problem and maybe Admin could help us, is I don't know the age of the person writing the post and it would make a great deal of difference if I knew if I was replying to a 16 year old or a 45 year old in the fact that you all know the difference in talking to a 16 year old is the maturity level and the respect that you don't get until you are alot older. Maybe as part of our profile we should have, not a specific age, but age group ie 15-20, 20-25 etc,etc.

The poll is not the right way to go as it doesn't have enough answers available, it is to black or white, it does'nt provide a solution to the question you are asking.

Maybe a Thread like mine does, and please remember when repling to this Thread that you put down your weapons and leave your affilliations at the door, lets unite and become one, even if it is only for this Thread.
And no, just because there are a few meanings of life and the Lord was mentioned and it is Sunday that I have been" Born Again" I have'nt had a near death experience just holding out an Olive Branch for the survival of our beloved Forums!!

God Bless and Sweet Dreams

Dave from Kiwiland!!

[pdg666]

I'm the guy who posted the poll and I'm 41, actually 42 in 2 weeks time

[v8coupe]

Another thing I find annoying, Is people starting a new thread / topic, that already has one. EG: sierra's.

Going over to Paul (PDG666's) thread now,
Just one thing BEV once emailed me, relating to my web page, but means same thing here. Said something like, remember all ages have access to the internet, and can read your posts. So lets keep this nice here.

[drof]

Thats my point V8 coupe, I would reply to a post differently if I knew it was a pimply immature 15 year old that knows nothing about life or respect ,than a more level headed mature older person (even though some of us get that way sometimes, no not older but immature in our replies)

31 year old

Dave from Kiwiland!!

[drof]

This is like one of those A.A meetings

Hi, my name is Dave and I'm 31 and........I'm a Diecastcollectingholic!!

Dave from Kiwiland!!

[frosty]

Hi, my name is Wayne and I'm 49 (50 in 2 weeks)

and........I'm a Diecastcollectingholic as well!!

[XR8]

I'm Ed, and I'm a Ford-o-holic as well as a Diecastcollect-a-holic....
I'm currently in my 33rd year of this affliction!!
I actually agreed with the poll, as it gets very annoying to sort through some of the rubbish posts on here.
I do realise that we all get a bit hot under the collar as 'Drof' rightly pointed out; but something, or some degree of moderation needs to be looked at.
As mentioned by 'Admin' on the odd occaision, the forum is paid for from his own pocket, and I for one won't mind if things are tidied up a bit. Something like this can only improve the forum, and make it much more enjoyable for all.
On top of that, potential members will be able to peruse our posts, and hopefully gain an understanding of acceptable
forum etiquette!!

Ed :)

[paranoid]

I don't think there is an easy solution and believe that showing age on the forums cannot make a difference either.

I also resent the implication that younger people are neccessarily immature and disrespectful. I am 19 and would not ever dream of reacting in the way some (older?) people have on these forums, i generally read and sit back unless I have something useful and respectful to contribute.

So now you know my age would you treat me any differently, like the old lady on the bus that looks like she is scared im going to mug her, or the people that see me and my car with p plates and assume i'm going to run them down?

Sorry, i digress... this wasnt meant to be an essay.

Everyone should just think about what they say, and treat people as you would have them treat you, it's not hard, maybe some more monitors would work. I conceed though, that if you knew a persons age you could decide on your response, but as far as i'm concerned, disrespect from 16 year olds should be no more tolerated than from 56 year olds.

and no more generic statements...

[SWRT]

I'm only 15 and a half years old so drof don't say I'm immature cause I don't knock Ford or Holden(OK,I love to knock Mark Skaife ONLY).

[Hati]

Fence sitter on the H v. F debate and 34.
I think the poll is good to show what the general consensus is here. Not that anyone would admit to useless posts ;)
I think the ball is in admin's court now, perhaps pick a couple of guys from the members here to weed out the rubbish and leave everything technical to himself and Richard. I am surprised that with their workload at Biante still have the time to look in the forums.
By the way Paranoid, nicely put. Not bad for a 19 y.o.

[drof]

I know that some younger people mature faster than others, but as all the studies goes men really don't mature till their early to mid twenties. We all like to think we are all mature but put down our favourite footy team or favourite Racing Car and you'll see a great transformation. A good example of this is on top of the Hill at Bathurst, one side Holden one side Ford. They throw insults and banter all day at one another, but it's not a case of not liking me personally but the Brand of car I am rooting for.
I still stick by my statements about maturity in younger people, you can't tell me someone of 15 is able to have the same in depth conversations as older people, they just don't have enough life experiences.
SWRT nothing personal but answer a few questions, do you argue with your parents/siblings? Do you fight with your parents about what time you have to be home from a party? Do you clean your room when asked? Do you do your fair share of chores without been asked or moaning about it? Do you do as your Teacher asks and don't answer back? Do you get smart to others fro no reason but to impress your friends? Do you, if you have one, treat your Girlfriend with the upmost respect and loyalty and put her before your mates? I could go on and on, but in all reality we were all once younger and we new how we were and acted and you may deny that your not immature, but at the end of the day maturity comes with age.
Another point is to paranoid. yes it is a good idea to sit back and read and read the posts before repling, but would you reply differently if someone put down something you were totally passionate about, and then in a reply to your post started putting down you personally? It is a Human trate that we trigger a self defence mechanisim and protect ourselfs the best we can.
From my observation on these Forums the most problems are from Holden supporters, one will put down a Ford supporter and then a Ford supporter will write back with a good answer then all of a suddan Wham, all the other Holden supporters come out of the woodwork and swarm on the poor Ford supporter like a bird of prey on a dead carcass.

Hati, your suggestion sounds like a AVESCO committe. How could 2 guys and one would be a Ford man and the other a Holden man, fairly edit Posts? Then what about the Chevy people, the Formula 1 people, the Rally people,etc etc, how would we get 2 unbaised people on these Forums.

[frosty]

I would like to thank Paul (pdg666) for raising the idea of the Poll.

It has generated constructive comment and made everyone 'think' about what has been written in the forums.

This can only help the forums in the future.

[wacpt]

Okay Guys
I have a message I received via email from drof-etah-I. He is still reading the posts and in his words,
[QUOTE]I made a promise to no longer contribute, John, so would you please pass this message onto the forum users.
My apologies to everyone concerned in regards to my first ever post on this forum. I found the comments about Peter Brock extremely offensive hence my verbal attack. My other posts were in no way an attack on anyone, simply replies as everyone else writes. My decision to cease contributing was made in an effort to calm the situation down only.
I do have one peace of advice though, careful consideration should be made as to HOW you write things meant to be taken light heartedly, since one word can turn an article from a joke to an attack as we have all seen.
Once again, my apologies to Biante and all other Forum users. QUOTE]
His name is Peter and is 37 . I hope we can ALL now move on from this.

[Andrew]

The whole process of writing replies on this forum is fraught with danger if your purpose is not to offend anyone, because we all come from so many different backgrounds, and have so many different points of view. I have from time to time been incensed at a post or two, and I have put my opinion down. Once or twice I feel it has been a little too forceful, but fortunately no one has taken offence to any of my posts (that I know of), for which I am happy. I don't engage in the Ford Vs Holden debate as neither car appeals to me (I am Nissan, Subaru, Mitsubishi etc., but am absolutely NOT a 'rice-boy'), although I definitely appreciate the importance and passion they have for other collectors such as yourselves. I had a series of running posts with a user over the merits of the 1992 Bathurts race and the GT-R winners. I thought that he was showing signs of profound ignorance on the issue, which really only turned out to be a misunderstanding. Fortunately, it was a civil exchange, when it could easily have been nasty. I appreciated the maturity of that particular poster on that occasion, and appreciated the fact that at the end of it all, there were no hassles. That's why I come to the Biante forum.

The problem of using a forum, or email, or any sort of written communication is that so often irony and sarcasm are not communicated in your message. So much depends on the delivery of the message, and the impersonal nature of forums etc. mean that often, subtle nuances and ironic references are not picked up. A harmless and fun message suddenly becomes nasty. This is unfortunate. And we have seen the results over and over in these forums.

I have no answers as to how to combat this, as often, smiley icons and 'thumbs ups' still don't convey the message truthfully. We could all perhaps take each post with a grain of salt, even if it appears that someone is taking a personal swipe at something we have said. After all, no-one comes onto these forums with the wish to make enemies do they?

PS. I am 24 years old, and like to think I can communicate with some level of sophistication and maturity.
PSS. Paranoid - that really was a good post with some great points.

[Hati]

drof I think that either I didn't make myself clear or you missunderstud my point.
I am not talking about an AVESCO like committe. I simply mean that moderators are needed because the guys from Biante don't have as much time as needed to keep things civil here. It is a normal way of functioning of a forum like medium to have several moderators look over the posts and calm things down by taking out partial or entire posts of the abusive or not to the point nature. H v. F has nothing to do with this, as arguments or should I say debates can be held in a civilised manner, no need for name calling or personal abuse of any kind. THIS is the job of a moderator. Of course an objective person would be much preferred. Don't tell me there is nobody here like that ;)

[paranoid]

I agree with Hati, you can't bring the Holden v Ford debate into this. As for most of the problems lying with Holden supporters, I would suggest that brand loyalty has even less to do with maturity than age does...

Drof, concerning passion, I feel very passionately about stereotyping young people, and my way to reply would be by means of reasoned argument, not stoop to personal attacks. If the only way someone is only able to reply to a reasoned comment is to attack the person then in my opinion they have no real basis for their argument and are not even worth my time in replying as they are unlikely to listen regardless. (not implying you do this at all).

Fair enough comments as regards life experiences, I wouldn't even pretend to be as knowledgeable as a person twice my age, it is obvious I do not have the experience, it is just not possible. However, in this instance, we are not talking about maturity regarding depth of conversation, of which I believe I possess, we are talking about basic respect for other people and knowing how and what to argue.

Furthermore, how many older people lose sight of reason and forget to treat people with maturity and respect, even a 45 y.o. person can get riled up and argue with parents/partner etc.. Maturity does partly come with age, but at the end of the day this is really about respect and common-sense.

As mentioned, this is a difficult forum to convey intent/subtlety, however, we should all realise this and interpret posts accordingly.

Just think and read over what you have written, if you debate, argue the merits of the topic, if you must resort to personal attacks it shows a lack of maturity, whatever your age, and your ignorance. Come on, we really shouldn't need moderators?

Sorry, I will let it go now I promise:), this isn't the forum for it, stereotypes infuriate me though :( .

[drof]

Hati and Paranoid,I can see were your both coming from, and I agree totally with you both, if we could take all the ideas from everybodies posts in this Thread we would have a good foundation for a good editing system. Paranoid my theory on immature replies probably is at the lower end of the age group 13-16 or 17 because lets face it and I'm talking from experience I did'nt grow up until I left home at 18. Fromall your replies paranoid I find you tobe a level headed, calm and knowledgable user and I wish therewere more users on this Forum like you.
You go on about how older people can be just as immature in their replies as younger members, I could'nt agree more, as I was guilty of personally attack a Forum user in one of his replies to my post and I carried on the fight with him for longer than it should have because neither would let go, with hindsight, and I was'nt aware of it at the time, was to have used "report this post to a moderator" icon at the bottom of each post. I vented my anger at the post writer and Biante for not banning him from the site or editing his post.
I have learnt from all of this and know all the right procedures to use.

Dave from Kiwiland!!