Phillip Island - Lowndes v Rick Kelly Decider

[Holden2003]

The motorsport season is finally coming to an end :(, and what a cracker of an end it will be (although artificially created by the points system). 7 points, which is equivalant of approximately 4 grid positions separate the two top drivers.

I don't care what people say about Rick, he has done what it takes to be champion this year, with only 1 race win and 0 round wins. It is not his fault that he is in the position he is in. We should all blame the real villians, VESA, for a crap points system.

I think there will be more pressure on the teams then on the drivers on the race weekend. Lowndes would be having nightmares of loose wheel-nuts, like the one that gave him a drive through last year. 1 Slip-up from the teams and its game over.

I would like to see Lowndes win, but both deserve it.

[05shan]

Agree, should be a cracker. While i support RK, Lowndes would be a worthy champion. Hopefully there will be no big accidents and good clean racing by all.

[lukey73]

Really comes back to consistency v wins and that what has happened this year, it would be hard to pick who is going to win.

If you Craig Lowndes do you go for the round win or just make sure you stay 1 position each race ahead of Rick Kelly to take the title by less than 5 points? Or if you Rick Kelly do you aim to stay in the top 5 and hope that Lowndes self distructs so you win the title !

Going to be great to watch, i for a Holden fan hope that Rick does it and i for a driver fan hope that Lowndes does it.

[Oh Five]

Anyone know if there is a event program online anywhere yet?

[brchi17]

Anyone know if there is a event program online anywhere yet?

I've not been able to find one anywhere either, considering that it's almost a week away I am rather surprised :rolleyes:

I am really a bit worried about this as last years Sunday program was the worse race meeting/day I've ever attended. There was a min 45minutes between each event, which made the day such a shocker :rolleyes:

[jediholden]

The motorsport season is finally coming to an end :(, and what a cracker of an end it will be (although artificially created by the points system). 7 points, which is equivalant of approximately 4 grid positions separate the two top drivers.

I don't care what people say about Rick, he has done what it takes to be champion this year, with only 1 race win and 0 round wins. It is not his fault that he is in the position he is in. We should all blame the real villians, VESA, for a crap points system.

I think there will be more pressure on the teams then on the drivers on the race weekend. Lowndes would be having nightmares of loose wheel-nuts, like the one that gave him a drive through last year. 1 Slip-up from the teams and its game over.

I would like to see Lowndes win, but both deserve it.

Agreed, About Rick. Lowndes has won before anway. It's our turn again;).

[HRT 1-2]

I probably agree with the sentiment that Craig probably deserves it more than Rick based on his performances but, my red blood overrules the head!;)

Unless 888 find some pace in Lowndes' car and provided Rick stays clean, I reckon Rick will bring it home!:)

[xtreem2001]

Until recently I have been (without doubt) the biggest critic Kelly has had to deal with. But after watching him perform in Bahrain I think he has grown in maturity this year. Maybe the two stints he did with Toddler have shown him that patience and a level head can do wonders in this up and down series.

I think either driver would make a better champion than the current one. On the up side if Kelly and Holden do win the championship it will give all the Ford fans someone to "have a go at" next year in a similar way all those Holden boys went after Ambrose.

It would be dissapointing if yet another champion won the title without really stamping any authority (in regard to wins) on the series but if we consider that the Toll/HSV team has dominated so much one could argue that Kelly is simply putting the icing on the cake for his team.

My only wish is that the eventual winner is decided on the track with some good hard racing. I think there are 2 drivers (Whincup and Toddler) who will also play a big part in which brand ends up with the spoils. That only makes the plot at lot more exciting in my view.

[CowboyMatt]

Until recently I have been (without doubt) the biggest critic Kelly has had to deal with. But after watching him perform in Bahrain I think he has grown in maturity this year. Maybe the two stints he did with Toddler have shown him that patience and a level head can do wonders in this up and down series.

I think either driver would make a better champion than the current one. On the up side if Kelly and Holden do win the championship it will give all the Ford fans someone to "have a go at" next year in a similar way all those Holden boys went after Ambrose.

It would be dissapointing if yet another champion won the title without really stamping any authority (in regard to wins) on the series but if we consider that the Toll/HSV team has dominated so much one could argue that Kelly is simply putting the icing on the cake for his team.

My only wish is that the eventual winner is decided on the track with some good hard racing. I think there are 2 drivers (Whincup and Toddler) who will also play a big part in which brand ends up with the spoils. That only makes the plot at lot more exciting in my view.

I think Tander will also play a role - after all he is Rick's team mate.

[wayno]

My only wish is that the eventual winner is decided on the track with some good hard racing...

Amen to that! Then there can be no reprucussions from either side. Let's just hope the ump has swallowed his whistle for a couple of days! :D

[CrankMYshaft]

Go Lowndes, and Go Bright to finished up as the winner again. Caterpillar to win the Caterpillar Grand Finale.

[Brutesutes]

GIVE us a break ford's have won enough atcc the last few years now its time for a real car to win the bloody thing come on the guy with the really squeakey voice! Rick! who's balls haven't dropped yet:D :)

[wayno]

How good is he going to be when they do! :D

[Brutesutes]

How good is he going to be when they do! :D:shocked3: What in another 10 years :D :D

[whitlam]

How good is he going to be when they do! :D

It'll probably happen during a race sometime...I can see him getting pole then jumping the start and on the way into pit lane for his drive through penalty he's a scared little boy then rolling through the pits something magical happens and they drop. When he comes out the other side of the pits he's now a man and manages to pass everyone* for the win :D



*most probably with the help of the SC :rolleyes:

[Holden2003]

John Bowe is set to leave BOC at the end of this weekend. This will be his last round with the team. In the press statement there is no mention of retirement but it seems that he will probably be doing so.

And Jeff Grech will be joining Supercheap Auto Racing a a senior consultant and will start immediately with them.

[CowboyMatt]

John Bowe is set to leave BOC at the end of this weekend. This will be his last round with the team. In the press statement there is no mention of retirement but it seems that he will probably be doing so.

I did read somewhere - it may well have been somewhere on this forum that he was going to drive one more year.

Hasn't been anywhere as competitive since he left DJR - anyone know what went down there?

[brchi17]

I did read somewhere - it may well have been somewhere on this forum that he was going to drive one more year......


PCR has been mentioned before

[the_goldie]

lol, Rick Kelly has a woman's voice.

Who cares what his voice sounds like -- I just want him to win all 3 races and take the championship. Even if he doesn't win the round as long as he is in front of Lowndes that would be great - just be better if he wins the final round to take the championship.

I don't go for the person with the best voice or looks -- it isn't a beauty pageant, not unless the drivers are entering the Bartercard MR V8 Supercar of the year award :rolleyes:

Good luck Rick.

[wayno]

I don't go for the person with the best voice or looks -- it isn't a beauty pageant, not unless the drivers are entering the Bartercard MR V8 Supercar of the year award :rolleyes:

Rick was a Cleo batchelor of the year finalist remember.

[awawaw]

Rick was a Cleo batchelor of the year finalist remember.

those kind of things are a joke, and THAT proves it!!!!!

[awawaw]

GIVE us a break ford's have won enough atcc the last few years now its time for a real car to win the bloody thing come on the guy with the really squeakey voice! Rick! who's balls haven't dropped yet:D :)

A real car??? Its half a Ford remember. It would be a real car it they used their own bits. I hope to (whoever) that Craig wins and not "Im better than Brock" Wrick.

[wayno]

A real car??? Its half a Ford remember. It would be a real car it they used their own bits. I hope to (whoever) that Craig wins and not "Im better than Brock" Wrick.

Yawn!

[Tumbo]

I just hope it ocmes down to a nail-biting last race; bbut having said that it would be better if it were a result of true racing and not engineering the result

[szwadiak100]

Go Rick!

[mick xu1]

I hope Rick does it for the General.......... and to hear the Lion Roar!!!!!!

[toddy05]

A real car??? Its half a Ford remember. It would be a real car it they used their own bits. I hope to (whoever) that Craig wins and not "Im better than Brock" Wrick.

What? I do not get it, the only Holden bits are the front splitter (still?) and the rear panhard rod style suspension. The rest is all fomoco style, as for the Holdens, they carry a surprising amout of fomoco style bits too with their front suspension style and diff.

The whole holden ford thing is just marketing. If there weren't sales dollars in it they would not be doing it and VESA would be dead. The cars resemble aesthetically somewhat of what is in the showroom, under the skin well lets forget that.

[toddy05]

I really hope Lowndesey does it as he really seems to have had the performance edge if not the consistency. Mind you if Rick does he has done it and grown in maturity and figured the system with some self restraint where Lowndesey possibly has not. Both worthy but Lowndesey moreso in my opinion.

[Rob]

If Lowndes does win it will be in a slightly different looking car.
Betta have officially gone to be replaced early by Vodafone.
Small image of the new look car on the V8 website.

[Chev_350]

.
Small image of the new look car on the V8 website.

can't find it

[Rob]

http://www.v8supercar.com.au/news/latestnews/newsd isplay.asp?Ind=M&author=&gid=22380827

It's on the NEWS section with header being : Triple 8 Making the most of now.
There is a larger pic on the CC forums.

[the_goldie]

Anyone got any times from practice... Can not view live timing@work...

[Leigh]

Can you view Natsoft (http://www.natsoft.com.au/cgi-bin/results.cgi?10/12/2006.PHIL) Cameron?

[Nobes]

After an hour Lowndes is fifth fastest, R Kelly is 10th. Ingall is fastest ATM.

[the_goldie]

Leigh - yes I can get to that site, but unfortunately it isn't live as such... Just wanted to know how they were all running at the moment :) Thanks for the tip though.

Cheers Nobes :)

[Nobes]

After about 80 minutes:

T Kelly fastest 1:34:83
R Kelly second 1:35:11

Lowndes seventh 1:35:54

[Nobes]

About 15 mins to go:

Tander first 1:33:74
Lowndes sixth 1:35:01
R Kelly seventh 1:35:11

[Nobes]

Final Practice Order:
Bright 1:33:73
Tander 1:33:74
Winterbottom 1:34:38
Whincup 1:34:59
Ingall 1:34:64
Owen 1:34:67
Skaife 1:34:72
J Richards 1:34:77
T Kelly 1:34:79
Davison 1:34:80

13th R Kelly 1:34:99
14th Lowndes 1:35:01

[fomoco04]

The FPR cars are comming on song at the end of the season arn't they.

[the_goldie]

The FPR cars are comming on song at the end of the season arn't they.

Was thinking the exact same thing. Bright's car is a rocket!!!

As long as after each session/race Kelly is in front of Lowndes I don't care where either of them finish ;)

Come on Rick!

[CowboyMatt]

Final Practice Order:
Bright 1:33:73
Tander 1:33:74
Winterbottom 1:34:38
Whincup 1:34:59
Ingall 1:34:64
Owen 1:34:67
Skaife 1:34:72
J Richards 1:34:77
T Kelly 1:34:79
Davison 1:34:80

13th R Kelly 1:34:99
14th Lowndes 1:35:01

What was Lowndes doing in the last 15 mins?

Based on earlier threads he must not have done another lap or not been able to post a faster time. Hope it's not an omen.

[Nobes]

They didnt have any commentary, just live timing, so not sure.

[wayno]

Lowndes was definately out there until the end of the session from what I could see. Big plaudits for Steve Owen. That's a massive effort and I hope like mad he can keep it up for the rest of the week-end.

[05shan]

What is goin on with Lowndes's, or should that be Lnowdes, car??? It looks horrid compared to the Betta livery. Is it to do with the new sponsorship:confused:
Go the General!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:D

[Holden2003]

What was Lowndes doing in the last 15 mins?

Based on earlier threads he must not have done another lap or not been able to post a faster time. Hope it's not an omen.

Honestly don't read a lot into practise. Some teams, particularly those in the top 10, often scrub their new tyres and get a qualifying run in towards the end so that their tyres loose their shine. Also the top 3 had this as their home track last year (are FPR still there?).

I would guess that Lowndes did not take out his new tyres and ran on olds for the weekend and focussed more on race pace. This weekend though would place a great emphasis on qualifying as this tends to not be a high passing track.

[BILLFORD1]

I'm just hoping that the final outcome for the season will be arrived at by racing rather than penalties for dirty windscreens etc etc... :D

[streettuner]

Just saw Jeff Grench on bigpond coverage kinda odd to see him in the super cheap auto garage fully kitted out in uniform. Anybody know about this?

[Tumbo]

been reported since the start of this week; Jeff has taken over a management job for the team. Perhaps they are hoping his can be the midas touch for the future given their dismal showing this yr

[Nobes]

http://www.v8supercar.com.au/news/latestnews/newsd isplay.asp?Ind=M&author=&gid=22344782

The story is at the link above.

[Buffalo]

Calling all aspiring commentators ! ... As I am sitting at a remote spot in Indonesia and with no TV or access to live timing - Could I ask a favour and get someone to post up some of the main action for race 1 ?? ... Not a blow by blow but maybe just some position updates every 5 or ten laps or so ?? Would very much appreciate it !! :)

[Buffalo]

OK - so it now seems Race 1 is finished with Lowndesy 4th and RK 5th ! ... 116 vs 112 points means Lowndesy is only 4 points behind now ... C'mon Lowndesy ! If Lowndesy can finish one spot ahead of RK for each of the last two races he'll have it done !!

[Holden2003]

Great Heart-stopping race, and Rick Kelly and Lowndes were around all the action. I thought it was Lowndes that punted off Richards at the start. Then Skaife and Lowndes and Bright in what was a thrilling battle. The TV director did not have to do much, the two contenders pitted the same time, and they were almost in the same camera shots at every point in the circuit.

I am a fair bit puzzled by Caterpillar sponsoring this event. There are no Cat signs around the circuit (saw 1 styrofoam sign) and the main straight had Sanyo and Big Pond signage. Also Cat is pulling out of FPR.

[trustme]

It appears it is Lowndes vs HRT and HSV. SO much for Schenken saying he would keep "Other" teams out of it leaving it a two car race for the Championship.

[castkrazy]

It appears it is Lowndes vs HRT and HSV. SO much for Schenken saying he would keep "Other" teams out of it leaving it a two car race for the Championship.

HRT and HSV clearly have pace and they're entitled to run their own race and have a red hot go just the same as anybody else at the top end of the field so I don't understand your comment .:confused:

There are more than 2 cars out there and nobody else should have to give up position just to accomodate a 2 car race .

[trustme]

If Kelly had been beside Skaife on the outside at the Hay shed would Skaife have given in enough room or driven him off the track like he did to Lowndes?

If Lowndes had gotten past Skaife would Skaife have suddenly have falleninto to clutches of Kelly and mysteriously lost a place to him before the end on the race?

Shenken said he would not allow other cars to have an effect on the outcome of the Championship.

[Chriso]

If......

If......

Why not just tell the other 29 cars not to bother turning up tomorrow, would that be ok ???

[Holden2003]

It appears it is Lowndes vs HRT and HSV. SO much for Schenken saying he would keep "Other" teams out of it leaving it a two car race for the Championship.

I agree with Castkrazy, very puzzling comment. For the majority of the race it was Skaife, Bright and Lowndes in that battle. The Skaife thing was a fair scrap, and you got to remember passing is notoriously difficult. Had it been Bahrain, Skaife would of been blocking for sure.

[trustme]

Why not just tell the other 29 cars not to bother turning up tomorrow, would that be ok ???

Have you got their numbers?

[Chriso]

Touche ! ;)

[trustme]

Lets get on with the racing. Mind you I have no nails left.

And on a final note before I head of to get some ZZZZZZZZZ wouldn't it be boring if we liked all drivers and all teams and we all agreed on everything and didnt care who won or lost but just watched if for the spectacle.

I would rathergo knitting

[castkrazy]

let's just enjoy the racing tomorrow and let them battle it out among themselves and hope the winners deserve it on their merits , hopefully without any tomfoolery . ;)

[05shan]

Awesome race, Lowndes-Skaife scrap was awesome. Didnt think Lowndesy would have a go at Skaify on the outside of the Hay Shed!!!!! Unreal racing. Kelly a bit of the pace compared to Lowndesy hopefully he will pick it up Tomorrow.

[cooper1117]

Wow the action just does not stop. And I think it wont be over today either - interesting to see if more happens in the next few days!!

[spoonster05]

would have been a 'racing incident' if it involved anyone else or was at another round of the series

[cooper1117]

How about Tander ha - Race 3 and he is setting lap records - where was that pace race 2!!!

[daggy]

What a crap end to the series. The officials are gonna stuff it up AGAIN!.
Tander said he had fuel regulator probs in race 2. Not sure if it was just an excuse for holding lnowdes up!

[awawaw]

What a crap end to the series. The officials are gonna stuff it up AGAIN!.
Tander said he had fuel regulator probs in race 2. Not sure if it was just an excuse for holding lnowdes up!

any excuse will do. he must of plucked that one out of a hat.

[Mark]

Would have to say that this leaves a very bad taste in the mouth....

Would have been a classic if the race was won fairly with no cars being damaged. A drive-through does not do the series justice.

[cooper1117]

any excuse will do. he must of plucked that one out of a hat.

Did you see the way Rick went past in the first lap of race 2. Tander flagged his intentions from the beginning of the race, he was there to support no doubt about it. In race 3 when there was no reason to support Tander showed his true pace. Shame he did not just get on with it in race 2. He has lost a bit of my support, I thought he was better than that. I think everyone just wanted a clean fight between the two contenders. I am a Holden man but must admit I felt sorry for Lowndes as he definately was the under dog, not only was he taking on Rick, but he had to contend with Skaife, Todd Kelly and Tander. Lowndes was definately the underdog, and we all love an underdog!!

[mick78]

I was really hoping that Craig would do it, but congratulation to Rick Kelly - he is champion and Holden have bragging rights - good luck to them - welldone.

Now.... whoever organised this pathetic travesty of rules that has allowed the best and most consistent driver to come second can you please report to my place and allow me to covey my gratitude and felicitations to you with my cricket bat.....

[BIGJIM]

Would have to say that this leaves a very bad taste in the mouth....

Would have been a classic if the race was won fairly with no cars being damaged. A drive-through does not do the series justice.

terrible way to win the cship. Kelly cant take any joy from this, i think he will always wonder whether he wouldve won it fair and square. oh well "thats racin" as they say.

hopefully his voice breaks over the summer!!

[1370]

Miserable end to a miserable year.

Let the court action begin :rolleyes:

[xtreem2001]

He may be the 06 champion BUT one gets the feeling there is a Kelly in the paddock that will be remembered for all the WRONG reasons.

[mick78]

I think it will be forgotten, if there is no legal action then Kelly is champ and will always be remebered as such. There were some lousy tactics this weekend but the end result is Kelly is the 2006 champ and will go into the record books as such. We should get over it...

What needs to be changed is the points. In reality it should never have been allowed to get to this point there should have been a clear winner by now. The orgainisers have contrived and massaged the points in such a way that it almost was certain to go to "golden point." (as in NRL) if you get my drift.

[cooper1117]

IMO Kelly will be another Ingall. Drive to consistancy and will not back it up the next year. To win back to back you have to be a racer and Skaife and Ambrose have shown us that. Consistancy will not get you there next year and Rick will fade away.

My tips for next year will be Tander, Lowndes, Todd Kelly and Skaife. You wont hear Ricks name next year as we did not hear Ingalls this year.

Bring on 2007 lets go racing!!

[lukey73]

I wonder if Rick looked at M.Schumacher's 97 final race! :rolleyes:

[jmac]

well what a dog,well thats it for me and about 6 family members going to the races and spending hard earned money on this crap that tom and his mates have turned a good series into.

[Martin Thomas]

IMO Kelly will be another Ingall. Drive to consistancy and will not back it up the next year. To win back to back you have to be a racer and Skaife and Ambrose have shown us that. Consistancy will not get you there next year and Rick will fade away.

My tips for next year will be Tander, Lowndes, Todd Kelly and Skaife. You wont hear Ricks name next year as we did not hear Ingalls this year.

Bring on 2007 lets go racing!!

I don't know. I think Rick has good race smarts. We don't know how fast he is as he just wanted to finish in the top ten to win the championship. Many wont agree, but I think he showed more maturity than Lowndes this year. How many times did we see Lowndes put himself at risk when he had a championship on the line. tapping people to gain 1 place, going around Skaife to gain 1 place while Kelly was behind him. Lowndes is a racer, no doubt, but he could have done more to win the championship, IMHO.

[Tumbo]

Give Lowndes and Kelly a dummy each; "Oh Campbell there appear to be cars in front of me.....why is that I should be champion" oh brother.............interesting that when 4/5 in race two Lowndes would have taken a 1 point lead but 3/4 and its even.....riiiight :confused:

[Dingo]

Maybe a new award for this season: "The Golden Pacifier Award" :D

[Goodwrench3]

What a pity. 'Champion' and 'Rick Kelly' are two terms I'll never associate with each other. A very bad day for V8Supercar racing.

[John Harney]

I received a warning this thread might get ugly and so far two posts have had to be edited because of comments made. At the moment, both myself and Nathan are still trying to watch the last race telecast, but it's not much fun now, because of having to monitor this thread, we have found out who won and the race is only 4 laps in. Thanks guys.

[AMBER ROSE]

I am so disapiontened with the final 3 races ie: Phillip island this year.

Lowndes was held up in all 3 races and eventually taken out in the third race. Very disappionting finish to an otherwise excellent year of racing. This stuff really needs to be addressed and should be investigated thoughoughly. As the spectators said halfway through race 3, SHAME HOLDEN SHAME. If this is the way that championships are won or lost then the sport has lost me.
BRING ON AMBROSE IN THE USA........

V8'S HAVE GONE TO THE DOGS.............

[BIGJIM]

I received a warning this thread might get ugly and so far two posts have had to be edited because of comments made. At the moment, both myself and Nathan are still trying to watch the last race telecast, but it's not much fun now, because of having to monitor this thread, we have found out who won and the race is only 4 laps in. Thanks guys.

poor didums.....thats not our fault you sandgropers are hours behind us. you guys would have found out anyway through this thread, controversy or no controversy. you will survive...

[John Harney]

HAHAHAHAHAHA true, but was looking forward to watching it in air conditioned comfort on the big screen instead of the crappy small TV in the non air con study of mine.

[BIGJIM]

HAHAHAHAHAHA true, but was looking forward to watching it in air conditioned comfort on the big screen instead of the crappy small TV in the non air con study of mine.

i watched it on the big screen & it didnt make it any better!! knowing the outcome maybe wouldve been easier to take if it was a fair fight hey?? as said before in a previous post "leaves a very bad taste in the mouth".

[John Harney]

Because of my position and the fact we must remain unbiased in all incidents, my views can't be posted, but I can say it did bring back memories of the old days when they were allowed to "race" hard. There has to be a winner in every race, and unfortunately there has to be a loser. What it has shown is next year, it's going to be interesting with so many Ford teams finally finding their legs and pushing hard.

[AmonFan]

If they were all in Sigma's what would have been the opinion of the weekends events, lol...........

[gab73]

If they were all in Sigma's what would have been the opinion of the weekends events, lol...........

Gee there bloody fast sigma's

[John Harney]

If they were all in Sigma's what would have been the opinion of the weekends events, lol...........


UMMM, ERRRRRR, UMMMMMM, "what was I doing watching it"

[1370]

I wonder if Rick looked at M.Schumacher's 97 final race! :rolleyes:

At least in F1 something will be done about it. There they don't have to please anybody. They outright threw MS out of that year's standings, hurting Ferrari financially.

Here they have to try and split the results between the various teams. I bet nothing will be done because a different badge won. TC was all smiles when he was chatting to the TEGA manager during the coverage. I bet they both will love the publicity that will be generated over the next few months if Triple Eight do try and take the matter further.

[1370]

If they were all in Sigma's what would have been the opinion of the weekends events, lol...........

Surely some in the crowd would have wondered where they could buy such an advanced looking Kingswood...

[AmonFan]

lol, well how about Daewoos, opps, nah that gives the Holden Fans someone to support..... just intrigues me that this type of incident happens in every class of racing, hell i copped it every heat of this years champs, lol but its only made a fuss about when its the Holden/Ford thing......

[AMBER ROSE]

At least in F1 something will be done about it. There they don't have to please anybody. They outright threw MS out of that year's standings, hurting Ferrari financially.

Here they have to try and split the results between the various teams. I bet nothing will be done because a different badge won. TC was all smiles when he was chatting to the TEGA manager during the coverage. I bet they both will love the publicity that will be generated over the next few months if Triple Eight do try and take the matter further.

Exactly right. At least in F1 they would act(as per MS's actions). To give 2 holden drivers bad sportsmanship flags in race 1 and 2 and then to be taken in race 3 is a DISCRACE. Tander held Lowndes up in race 2 the when given the warning picked his pace up by 1 sec per lap...Go figure..

Interesting to her a very diplomatic Ambrose commentating...

[John Harney]

just intrigues me that this type of incident happens in every class of racing, hell i copped it every heat of this years champs, lol but its only made a fuss about when its the Holden/Ford thing......

Because ALL Motor sport in Australia is regarded at a second rate sport. And I come to this conclusion because how much Motor sport is actually televised. V8 Supercars, F1 and WRC are the only one that recieve regular coverage. There's so many other forms of Motor Sport that only get 2 or 3 minutes a month. Guess this makes the V8's a bit of a circus.

[AMBER ROSE]

Because ALL Motor sport in Australia is regarded at a second rate sport. And I come to this conclusion because how much Motor sport is actually televised. V8 Supercars, F1 and WRC are the only one that recieve regular coverage. There's so many other forms of Motor Sport that only get 2 or 3 minutes a month. Guess this makes the V8's a bit of a circus.

John,

I might be a bit more animated than normal today ( thanks to a few Brewskies) and my spelling may not be up to speed. That is the best comment I have heard on this forum in quite some time.

[Holden2003]

OK Race over. I am glad that Rick won, but it was very anticlimatic. In My opinion Lowndes was very wide and maybe even jumped on the brakes a fair bit early. Thats my opinion.

I do not feel it was anywhere near the 94 or 97 Schumacher incidents, as it did not look as malicious. If Rick wanted to drill Lowndes, he had so many more opportunities in the weekend where he could of finished his job, and probably finish his career at the same time.

These guys could of clashed at any point in the season, however it happened in the last round when they were on equal points. If they clashed like that at New Zealand for instance, Rick would of been given the drive through, and there would have probably been no formal protest to be taken. However, due to the fact it is the last round, and there is so much media focus on the event, 888 will be going for all guns blazing to win in court. Its my opinion that if this hypothetically happened in an earlier round, no protest would occur abou the result at that round, so there should be no protest now, therefore Rick should be champion.

I felt Lowndes lossed the championship at Clipsal 500. That non finish in the second race was the difference between the two. They both had very close average finishes, bad umpire calls and luck not go their way, but had Lowndes finished that race, we would not be having the argument that whether Rick deserves the championship.

[Malik]

ya know.... after watching that I have to say the ONE thing that really really really got up my nose...

Leigh bloody stiffey HAVING to throw in one last "its a pressure cooker situation" ......

nuff said.

[AMBER ROSE]

In all honesty I feel as sorry for Rick as I do for Craig given the way the season ended and given his comments on the stand I think he feels the same. All anyone wanted was a fair race.

[Dingo]

Because ALL Motor sport in Australia is regarded at a second rate sport.
Any sport that isn't AFL, NRL or cricket is a second rate sport in Australia...

[Holden2003]

Because ALL Motor sport in Australia is regarded at a second rate sport. And I come to this conclusion because how much Motor sport is actually televised. V8 Supercars, F1 and WRC are the only one that recieve regular coverage. There's so many other forms of Motor Sport that only get 2 or 3 minutes a month. Guess this makes the V8's a bit of a circus.

And as it should be to in my opinion. The amount of spectators that watch AFL/NRL/Horse Racing (Yes Horse Racing) is so much larger then motorsport, and easier to co-ordinate television programming.

The problem with motorsport is that it does not get respect by the public who do not follow it as being a mainstream sport as some other sports with much smaller following get (ie cricket, soccer, basketball, tennis).

I am a motorsport fan first and foremost, but I am definetely aware that other sports have a greater following, and have easier abilty to secure corporate and government funds to survive and thrive, and have in most cases a larger public awareness of the product it provides.

[gab73]

Congratulations Rick Schumacher

[VXfan]

Well as I couldn't find a single channel over here in pommy land who was showing the V8's,I have just woken up and checked the V8 website and controversial or not,RICK KELLY,GOOD ON YA MY SON!!!!!!!
Woohoo!!
Off to the CC board now to see how many blue boys are whining lol
Cheers,
Tony.

[Nathan Rzepecki]

Any sport, motor sport or other often ends in tears when a championship comes down to the wire such as today. If anyone was to think today was not going to end in tears or decided by a call made by the stuarts haven't watch this series for the last few years.

[inter]

IMO Kelly will be another Ingall. Drive to consistancy and will not back it up the next year. To win back to back you have to be a racer and Skaife and Ambrose have shown us that. Consistancy will not get you there next year and Rick will fade away.

My tips for next year will be Tander, Lowndes, Todd Kelly and Skaife. You wont hear Ricks name next year as we did not hear Ingalls this year.

Bring on 2007 lets go racing!!


No, Ingall was alway faster than Kelly

[vikings100]

Go Rick, about time Holden won the championship back.

[XTRALO]

Congratulations Rick Schumacher

that made me laugh :)

Congratulations Rick Kelly

[bargs35]

Ok.
I think everyone needs to take their glasses off, be they blue or red, and have a look at the bigger picture.

You drive to the rules given. At the start of the year, V8SA, the IPO, and the DSO set the standards on what is fair play and what isnt, and what type of racing should be rewarded. I have heard countless times 'Lowndes deserves it more, because he's won more'. To an extent this is true - he has won more races so it should only make sense that he win the championship right? However R. Kelly sat down over Christmas, worked out what needed to be done, and did it. Kelly drove smarter than Lowndes all year by staying out of Diffey's 'pressure cooker situations' by consistently placing top 5 and not unneccessarily risking a good points haul. This was decided by V8SA, not Rick. I've read interviews and heard Rick say "Next year will be good because we'll be able to give it a red hot go". He is a true racer the same as Lowndes, but this year acknowledged the fact that bravado and ballsy moves wouldnt win him the championship, so drove a relatively safe year to win it. Smart move.
However in saying all this, Rick has the raw pace to match it with the best, he just chose not to throw it down the inside on every occasion.
At the same time, the IPO and DSO set the standards for a move like Ricks in R3, by penalising drivers in earlier rounds for a similar infringement with a drive through penalty. It was only a small nudge (very reminiscent of Lowndes' nudge on J. Richards at Indy actually), but it had dire consequences for Lowndes. The rules should be hard and unwavering, and not change just because there is a championship on the line. They also set a standard in R1&2 by making it clear that blocking was not allowed until the last 2 or 3 laps (noone seems to know these days do they?). Personally i find this the most illogical rule. Part of being a race driver is coping with a car that isnt quite there, and holding position, fending off the driver attacking from behind. A driver should be entitled to position his car in any place he chooses, so long as there is no double-movement. However these rules of fair play were decided upon, and must be obeyed.

Now put all this in the context of the weekend:
Lowndes was held up in R1 & R2. This led to bad sportsmanship flags going out, and the blocking was stopped. When GT kept going, he was black-flagged, so fair enough, he had to come in and serve his drive through.
Come race 3, Lowndes decided to give Toll HSV a taste of their own medicine. He moved over to cover his line, which it had been made clear was not considered fair driving. At the same time Rick was trying to put a move down the inside, and the rest is history. It wasnt a big hit, just enough to turn him around, and going from previous rounds a drive through was served (fair enough) but the penalty should not be larger just because a championship is on the line. It is plainly obvious to see that Rick didnt 'punt' Lowndes off intentionally, because not only are there far better ways to do it, but also the hit was so light that by themselves, they would have both escaped trouble free. The fact that the HRT car was there meant Craig had to try to avoid it, by turning in more, losing the rear end more at the same time, and eventually binning it. If the HRT car wasnt there, it would have been game on, but it was, so game over.


For the records, I wear red glasses and Rick also happens to be my favourite driver, so as much as today was awesome, it was slightly disappointing to have it end as it did (even though I know Rick would have won it anyway :D). In saying that, I have huge respect for Lowndes and very much like him as a person/driver (just not those terrible cars with the blue badge! :D)

p.s. Inter: Ingall was always faster than Kelly? We shall see next year...wait until Rick gives it one of Brocky's 'red hot go's!!

[wayno]

Well done Rick. Made my day. I've watched the incident and that was no different to so many other taps I've seen this year that have gone unpinished. Rick got a drive through - that's the penalty as the regs stand.
A worthy champion who used the points system to his advantage just like Ingall did last year. OK, Rick didn't win a round, but his game plan for the year bought the desired result and I'm sure with next years points system he would have raced in a different manner.
He did what he had to and won. Well done.

[jediholden]

We won the round and the championship. I'm happy:). That's all I have to say on the matter.

[wayno]

Congratulations Rick Schumacher

Good call. Is he going to win seven championships is what you're saying, yes?

[jediholden]

Good call. Is he going to win seven championships is what you're saying, yes?


I damn well hope so!!!

[lukey73]

Ok.
I think everyone needs to take their glasses off, be they blue or red, and have a look at the bigger picture.

You drive to the rules given. At the start of the year, V8SA, the IPO, and the DSO set the standards on what is fair play and what isnt, and what type of racing should be rewarded. I have heard countless times 'Lowndes deserves it more, because he's won more'. To an extent this is true - he has won more races so it should only make sense that he win the championship right? However R. Kelly sat down over Christmas, worked out what needed to be done, and did it. Kelly drove smarter than Lowndes all year by staying out of Diffey's 'pressure cooker situations' by consistently placing top 5 and not unneccessarily risking a good points haul. This was decided by V8SA, not Rick. I've read interviews and heard Rick say "Next year will be good because we'll be able to give it a red hot go". He is a true racer the same as Lowndes, but this year acknowledged the fact that bravado and ballsy moves wouldnt win him the championship, so drove a relatively safe year to win it. Smart move.
However in saying all this, Rick has the raw pace to match it with the best, he just chose not to throw it down the inside on every occasion.
At the same time, the IPO and DSO set the standards for a move like Ricks in R3, by penalising drivers in earlier rounds for a similar infringement with a drive through penalty. It was only a small nudge (very reminiscent of Lowndes' nudge on J. Richards at Indy actually), but it had dire consequences for Lowndes. The rules should be hard and unwavering, and not change just because there is a championship on the line. They also set a standard in R1&2 by making it clear that blocking was not allowed until the last 2 or 3 laps (noone seems to know these days do they?). Personally i find this the most illogical rule. Part of being a race driver is coping with a car that isnt quite there, and holding position, fending off the driver attacking from behind. A driver should be entitled to position his car in any place he chooses, so long as there is no double-movement. However these rules of fair play were decided upon, and must be obeyed.

Now put all this in the context of the weekend:
Lowndes was held up in R1 & R2. This led to bad sportsmanship flags going out, and the blocking was stopped. When GT kept going, he was black-flagged, so fair enough, he had to come in and serve his drive through.
Come race 3, Lowndes decided to give Toll HSV a taste of their own medicine. He moved over to cover his line, which it had been made clear was not considered fair driving. At the same time Rick was trying to put a move down the inside, and the rest is history. It wasnt a big hit, just enough to turn him around, and going from previous rounds a drive through was served (fair enough) but the penalty should not be larger just because a championship is on the line. It is plainly obvious to see that Rick didnt 'punt' Lowndes off intentionally, because not only are there far better ways to do it, but also the hit was so light that by themselves, they would have both escaped trouble free. The fact that the HRT car was there meant Craig had to try to avoid it, by turning in more, losing the rear end more at the same time, and eventually binning it. If the HRT car wasnt there, it would have been game on, but it was, so game over.


For the records, I wear red glasses and Rick also happens to be my favourite driver, so as much as today was awesome, it was slightly disappointing to have it end as it did (even though I know Rick would have won it anyway :D). In saying that, I have huge respect for Lowndes and very much like him as a person/driver (just not those terrible cars with the blue badge! :D)

p.s. Inter: Ingall was always faster than Kelly? We shall see next year...wait until Rick gives it one of Brocky's 'red hot go's!!

Bargs so contridictor in your Red/Blue glasses. I follow Holden but the way the Toll Team acted today was nothing short of shocking, fuel pressure problems my butt more like backing up a guy who can win the championship for your team mate who can win the championship to pass.

As for race 3, Looked to me like Craig was putting a move on Todd so Rick thought he would have a go at Craig on a dirty line and the result was he didnt break enough so the result is he kissed the back of Craigs car under full break pressure which was enough to spin him, it was pure luck that Todd was there so he didnt go all the way around.

For me Rick yes is the annointed champion but as was said after the debarcle of Rusty winning last year with minimal race/round wins he is an accumulator. Bring on 07 with a descent points structure that actually rewards those who race to win not race to finish in the top 7.

[TAG05]

I did not think it would take long for the whingers to pick up that Ricko drove into the back of lNOWdes and punted him off the road. If you take your glasses off (or put them on as the case may be) you can clearly see that CL drove down onto RK and forced him into the position he ended up in. I too wear a red shirt, but it is too clear on the TV Footage. Congratulations Ricko.

So do we now also see a championship winner 1:18??

[lukey73]

I did not think it would take long for the whingers to pick up that Ricko drove into the back of lNOWdes and punted him off the road. If you take your glasses off (or put them on as the case may be) you can clearly see that CL drove down onto RK and forced him into the position he ended up in. I too wear a red shirt, but it is too clear on the TV Footage. Congratulations Ricko.

So do we now also see a championship winner 1:18??

Tag i think it is you who needs to have there glasses checked. IF Rick had won by another means i would be the first to stand up and applaud but they way in which the Toll Team as a whole in race 2 and the way in which Rick drove in race 3 for me as a Holden supporter leaves a bad taste.

IMO Toll/Walkinshaw did what they had too to Win whether it was by the rules or knowing the penalty if you broke them.

[Chev_350]

well....yeah, this round was....well least you can't call it boring. Seriously if Rick's Championship gets taken off him thanks to the protest it will make the series an even bigger joke. both guys had their cars in positions where they they shouldn't have. Rick has paid the penelty, leave it at that, Yes it is unfortunate but it complacates thinks alot more if you have different rules for a finale race.

Congrats to the Kelly boys and Todd for champion in 07!

I must be careful tomorrow wearing my Toll shirt, where I change trains is right behind the Triple 8 workshop.

[xtreem2001]

To all the one eyed Holden boys out there. A lot can be taken from body language and if you all watched closely I think it was plain to see that the top Holden driver (Skaife) was not exactly jumping for joy. WHY???. I think he realises there are far better ways to get to the top.

I am NOT a Rick Kelly fan, simply because I think his attitude leaves a lot to be desired. If anyone can point me to a interview with this guy were he actually acknowledges that there are more experienced drivers than himself in the paddock I will reconsider that position but I am confident that there is NOT a more self centred person involved in the sport at present than this guy. His comments over the weekend were nothing short of ridiculous and why he DOES NOT deserve the accolades he will get for winning this year.

Had the championship gone to any of the other 3 drivers in HSV/TOLL I think it would have been thouroughly deserved. Tander was obviously told by Uncle Tom on what was expected of him and that is a shame. Maybe Skaife has realised that handing control of his team to a man who has no scruples was not such a great idea. Either way I hope the actions by Triple Eight and the pending publicity spotlight the shortfalls this series has and with any luck heads will roll starting at the top.

The plus side is that we can ALL get Foxtel and next year there will be another Aussie racer involved in some true motor sport activities. Ambrose must be smiling from ear to ear knowing that the rubbish he left behind has not changed. Wonder if there will be more drivers looking for a series that is decided with clean hard racing and not politics.

[TAG05]

Tag i think it is you who needs to have there glasses checked. IF Rick had won by another means i would be the first to stand up and applaud but they way in which the Toll Team as a whole in race 2 and the way in which Rick drove in race 3 for me as a Holden supporter leaves a bad taste.

IMO Toll/Walkinshaw did what they had too to Win whether it was by the rules or knowing the penalty if you broke them.

I dunno too much about that. HRT and Toll took a hit in R1 and R2, with lNOWdes complaining bitterly on the radio. Yep, fair call, GT held up 888 to the tune of 1 - 1.5s per lap. But if you are that much faster, then drive around and pass the guy.

Lowndes seemed to expect the title this year and could not take as good as he gave IMO. Each to their own and as everyone admits, it depends upon which colour shirt you wear, and will likely be argued over many a BBQ for years to come.

How about we all just have a beer, celebrate the championship and get over it regardless of red or blue??

[Dingo]

How about we all just have a beer, celebrate the championship and get over it regardless of red or blue??
Because people have way too much emotion wrapped up in the final result to see things clearly right now. It's like watching your footy team lose the grand final by a point because of a controversial call that could have gone either way. The rabid Ford fans will demand Lowndes be given the crown, regardless of the actual result, whilst the rabid Holden fans will crow over their man winning, regardless of how it was done.

There are people out there who take being a fan of motor racing WAAAAAAAY too seriously!

[lukey73]

Yep, fair call, GT held up 888 to the tune of 1 - 1.5s per lap. But if you are that much faster, then drive around and pass the guy.

How could he drive around him when he was doing a John Bowe sitting in the middle of the track and only slow through the corner, very hard to go around someone when they do something like that.

To all the one eyed Holden boys out there. A lot can be taken from body language and if you all watched closely I think it was plain to see that the top Holden driver (Skaife) was not exactly jumping for joy. WHY???. I think he realises there are far better ways to get to the top.


Xtreeme have to agree with you on that one, even when Rick got back to the pits he didnt seem as over the moon as Russell did last year.

I wonder if Roland did end up lodging that protest? If he did it should be an interesting week.

[GRPIII]

gee
theres alot of sour grapes on here.
these incidents have happened all year, do you really think rick meant it?
it could have easly went the other way, lowdnes lose a few spots while rick gets a drive thru.
my 2 cents on the matter, rules regarding the racing is destroying the series.
whats blocking, passing, up the inside, etc, must be sorted out by next.
as for tander blocking, yeah sure he did slow done but if lowndes teamate was quick enough & up front do you think he'd do any different.
you could say lowndes lost the championship earlier in the series tassie, taken out by his teamate, indy, pitlane penalty & then not re addressing the cichane issue.
kelly is the champ for 2006 & rightly deserved, the guy finished every single race so maybe if they didnt have to drop your worst round he may have been more in front.(anyone no which rounds who dropped?).

another note, is why some cars get drive thrus for a mirrors or bar hanging off etc for safety reasons, yet the officals let craig drive round on one of the fastest circuits in the country with severly damaged suspension & tyres, his crew didnt even check it out, just throw a new set of tyres, she'll be right. imagine if something let go a high speed, serious injury or death could happen to craig or another driver, very poor on 888 behalf, is a championship worth more than someone's life, shame 888 & officals for not even investigating the damage.

[HSVLOVER]

[QUOTE=TAG05;172184]I dunno too much about that. HRT and Toll took a hit in R1 and R2, with lNOWdes complaining bitterly on the radio. Yep, fair call, GT held up 888 to the tune of 1 - 1.5s per lap. But if you are that much faster, then drive around and pass the guy.

QUOTE]

the problem was that gt was blocking the racing line at every trurn so you cannot pass

i must say congratulations to to the whole v8 crew ( not drivers or teams but officials ) who have really turned me off the v8 supercar series over the choping and changing of rules and interpretations

as for the 15 and 888 crash - to me rkelly went in too hard and pushed craig into tkelly causing 888 into some serious damage which changed the outcome of the race ( reminds me of ambrose of old - too hard to beat them properly so just ram em off )

anyway nothing will hapen as per usual so we should all get over it
just to let you all know i wear red goggles

[05shan]

I must be careful tomorrow wearing my Toll shirt, where I change trains is right behind the Triple 8 workshop.
Dare ya to do a victory lap in their workshop:p

Congrats to Rick well done!
RK paid the price for a incident which was not entirely his fault. IMO the race is over and it should be left on the track, not finished in a court room. This is whats wrong with the series, amongst other things.
Tander did what any good team mate would have, I'm sure if the situation was reversed, triple 8 would have done the same thing. Thats my opinion anyway;)

The trophy is back were it belongs!!!!!!!!!!:D

[XR8]

At least the track was cooler today.........

Ed :)

[wrxwrc]

Well iv just returned from the Island - great weekend of racing i might add!! BUT like a few of u have said would of been nice to see the battle last the whole race!! Im a Holden supporter and was obviously cheering Rick on, but i just wanted to see a 'great' race between two great drivers and teams - shame it kinda ended up being a anti-climax...
Happy to see Rick win the Championship but it would of been more exciting if it was without the 'controversial' finish.
On a side note which alot of you wouldnt have seen...I was down on the Pit Wall after the podium presentation etc and who comes out to sign autographs for all the fans - the man who just lost the Championship!! Thought that really was a BIG EFFORT considering what had just occured all of 5mins earlier! Craig Lowndes is a Champion for that in my eyes...Especially for the fact that when Rick returned to his Garage after the press conference alot of supporters and fans yelled out to him to come over for photos etc BUT NO, he walked to the Garage Wall then turned around and went back inside! Alot of young & older fans alike were what id say slightly 'peaved'...
So that probably just goes to prove that you dont always have to be a winner on the track to be a winer and highly liked person off the track!!but Atleast Craig Lowndes can sleep tonight knowing that he is a 'true man' and will continue to be supported by Holden and Ford Fans - certainly made me a bigger fan of his!

[05shan]

gee
theres alot of sour grapes on here.
these incidents have happened all year, do you really think rick meant it?
it could have easly went the other way, lowdnes lose a few spots while rick gets a drive thru.
my 2 cents on the matter, rules regarding the racing is destroying the series.
whats blocking, passing, up the inside, etc, must be sorted out by next.
as for tander blocking, yeah sure he did slow done but if lowndes teamate was quick enough & up front do you think he'd do any different.
you could say lowndes lost the championship earlier in the series tassie, taken out by his teamate, indy, pitlane penalty & then not re addressing the cichane issue.
kelly is the champ for 2006 & rightly deserved, the guy finished every single race so maybe if they didnt have to drop your worst round he may have been more in front.(anyone no which rounds who dropped?).

another note, is why some cars get drive thrus for a mirrors or bar hanging off etc for safety reasons, yet the officals let craig drive round on one of the fastest circuits in the country with severly damaged suspension & tyres, his crew didnt even check it out, just throw a new set of tyres, she'll be right. imagine if something let go a high speed, serious injury or death could happen to craig or another driver, very poor on 888 behalf, is a championship worth more than someone's life, shame 888 & officals for not even investigating the damage.
Appears Triple 8 were trying to play the simpathy card:p :D

[xa351gt]

What BS that final race was. A TRUE Champion doesn't HAVE to wreck his competition to win. He was outclassed by Lowndes in race 1 & 2 and knew that without taking him out he'd not beat him. The race officials should have gave him a finish of one postion behind Lowndes as that is where he was going to finish. By not PROPERLY penalizing him they have opened up a policy where drivers will just take out each other and retaliate when it happens . What will then take place are either injuries or innocent third partys being involved or both. Bottom line is he is NO champion ,just a thief who by this move destroyed what had been a great season that he had.

[lxss383]

What BS that final race was. A TRUE Champion doesn't HAVE to wreck his competition to win. He was outclassed by Lowndes in race 1 & 2 and knew that without taking him out he'd not beat him. The race officials should have gave him a finish of one postion behind Lowndes as that is where he was going to finish. By not PROPERLY penalizing him they have opened up a policy where drivers will just take out each other and retaliate when it happens . What will then take place are either injuries or innocent third partys being involved or both. Bottom line is he is NO champion ,just a thief who by this move destroyed what had been a great season that he had.


are you for real?

[05shan]

What BS that final race was. A TRUE Champion doesn't HAVE to wreck his competition to win. He was outclassed by Lowndes in race 1 & 2 and knew that without taking him out he'd not beat him. The race officials should have gave him a finish of one postion behind Lowndes as that is where he was going to finish. By not PROPERLY penalizing him they have opened up a policy where drivers will just take out each other and retaliate when it happens . What will then take place are either injuries or innocent third partys being involved or both. Bottom line is he is NO champion ,just a thief who by this move destroyed what had been a great season that he had.
I thought he was properly penalised according to the rule book.:confused:

[xa351gt]

another note, is why some cars get drive thrus for a mirrors or bar hanging off etc for safety reasons, yet the officals let craig drive round on one of the fastest circuits in the country with severly damaged suspension & tyres, his crew didnt even check it out, just throw a new set of tyres, she'll be right. imagine if something let go a high speed, serious injury or death could happen to craig or another driver, very poor on 888 behalf, is a championship worth more than someone's life, shame 888 & officals for not even investigating the damage.[/QUOTE]

Why not wrecking someone and spinning them into front of other competitors was worth it for Kelly to win (steal) the championship. Lowndes is a good enough driver that if something felt really wrong he would have pulled off . He has class something Kelly obviously needs to learn. Had that been probably anyone Lowndes would have circulated long enough to return the favor and wrecked him.

[A9L]

Well done Rick

[beast]

To me this should happen from the driving from the factory Holdens this weekend. (ps im currently waering a HRT shirt).

Mark Skaife Race 1: Drive-Through Penalty.
Garth Tander Race 2: Disqualified, docked 100 points.
Rick Kelly Race 3: Disqualified, $5,000 fine, docked 500 points, 12 month suspension from racing.

[Martin Thomas]

REMINDER FOR THE FORD PEOPLE. TURN AWAY IF YOU DON"T LIKE FACTS TO GET IN THE WAY OF A GOOD EXCUSE...

Kelly passed Lowndes after Lowndes stuffed up on the track, it may have been pressure, who knows, but KELLY PASSED LOWNDES IN RACE 2 FAIR AND SQUARE.

Lowndes got past Kelly in the PITS. THE PITSTOP.

Lowndes did not outclass Kelly. I think Kelly gave Lowndes a lesson on the track. All you could hear was Roland telling Lowndes to settle down, all the time. Lowndes ran a risky weekend considering his position. Fancy going trying to pass Skaife on the outside when he was in front of Kelly.

Sorry, flame suit on, but I think Lowndes lost the championship due to.. for want of a better word.... inexperience. you could be excused to think Lowndes was new and did not see the bigger picture. The points system sucks, but I've seen Lowndes operate a less than perfect car to perfection, so why couldn't he operate a less than perfect points system better. I got the feeling that as soon as it got close, Roland was afraid it would end in tears. Lowndes is a great driver, but the points system demanded a consistent driver. And my 8 year old knew that.

If it is a shame Lowndes lost, I feel more for Tander. I think he was the best driver this year, but due to INCONSISTENCY, he was out of the hunt. Lets shed some tears for him as well, hey.

Lowndes can learn something from Rick just as Rick has a lot to learn from Lowndes.

Congratulations Rick. Lets hope you can perform when winning counts for something.. I wont be surprised if you have some more in the bag.

To be honest Im starting to enjoy the circumstances. Sad, but true..

[beast]

And Lowndes for Surfers: Docked 250 points, $1000 fine.

[AmonFan]

Beast, ud get a job with CAMS in no time ;)

[SWRT]

A true championship winner does not punt off opponents,Craig has never punted anybody off through out 2006.
The fairest penalty would be to take all of "bang-bang" Ricks R13 points way, and Winterbottom will beat him to 2nd in the title by 3 points.
The court-rooms could easily turn this into a Ford 1-2, time to extract to court-room heartache on Holden after stupidly disqualifying the Texico Sierras at Bathurst 1987.

[05shan]

REMINDER FOR THE FORD PEOPLE. TURN AWAY IF YOU DON"T LIKE FACTS TO GET IN THE WAY OF A GOOD EXCUSE...

Kelly passed Lowndes after Lowndes stuffed up on the track, it may have been pressure, who knows, but KELLY PASSED LOWNDES IN RACE 2 FAIR AND SQUARE.

Lowndes got past Kelly in the PITS. THE PITSTOP.

Lowndes did not outclass Kelly. I think Kelly gave Lowndes a lesson on the track. All you could hear was Roland telling Lowndes to settle down, all the time. Lowndes ran a risky weekend considering his position. Fancy going trying to pass Skaife on the outside when he was in front of Kelly.

Sorry, flame suit on, but I think Lowndes lost the championship due to.. for want of a better word.... inexperience. you could be excused to think Lowndes was new and did not see the bigger picture. The points system sucks, but I've seen Lowndes operate a less than perfect car to perfection, so why couldn't he operate a less than perfect points system better. I got the feeling that as soon as it got close, Roland was afraid it would end in tears. Lowndes is a great driver, but the points system demanded a consistent driver. And my 8 year old knew that.

If it is a shame Lowndes lost, I feel more for Tander. I think he was the best driver this year, but due to INCONSISTENCY, he was out of the hunt. Lets shed some tears for him as well, hey.

Lowndes can learn something from Rick just as Rick has a lot to learn from Lowndes.

Congratulations Rick. Lets hope you can perform when winning counts for something.. I wont be surprised if you have some more in the bag.

To be honest Im starting to enjoy the circumstances. Sad, but true..
Amen. I too feel for Tander as he is one of my fav drivers.:mad:

[lukey73]

REMINDER FOR THE FORD PEOPLE. TURN AWAY IF YOU DON"T LIKE FACTS TO GET IN THE WAY OF A GOOD EXCUSE...

Kelly passed Lowndes after Lowndes stuffed up on the track, it may have been pressure, who knows, but KELLY PASSED LOWNDES IN RACE 2 FAIR AND SQUARE.

Lowndes got past Kelly in the PITS. THE PITSTOP.

Lowndes did not outclass Kelly. I think Kelly gave Lowndes a lesson on the track. All you could hear was Roland telling Lowndes to settle down, all the time. Lowndes ran a risky weekend considering his position. Fancy going trying to pass Skaife on the outside when he was in front of Kelly.

Sorry, flame suit on, but I think Lowndes lost the championship due to.. for want of a better word.... inexperience. you could be excused to think Lowndes was new and did not see the bigger picture. The points system sucks, but I've seen Lowndes operate a less than perfect car to perfection, so why couldn't he operate a less than perfect points system better. I got the feeling that as soon as it got close, Roland was afraid it would end in tears. Lowndes is a great driver, but the points system demanded a consistent driver. And my 8 year old knew that.

If it is a shame Lowndes lost, I feel more for Tander. I think he was the best driver this year, but due to INCONSISTENCY, he was out of the hunt. Lets shed some tears for him as well, hey.

Lowndes can learn something from Rick just as Rick has a lot to learn from Lowndes.

Congratulations Rick. Lets hope you can perform when winning counts for something.. I wont be surprised if you have some more in the bag.

To be honest Im starting to enjoy the circumstances. Sad, but true..


Martin this isnt about Holden or Ford this about 2 drivers who where racing for a title.

This for me being a Holden supporter has to be the worst series win i can remember. If Rick had of gotten past Craig fairly i would have been jumping for joy but the way in which the Toll Team acted in races 2 & 3 was nothing short of disgraceful. The drivers/teams were warned not to effect the championship and im sorry to say that what GT and RK did.

Said it before and say it again bring on the new points system as that way the best driver would have one not the one who got the most points.

[xtreem2001]

Sort of explains why TW is a "hero" in the red paddock when you read comments like those of Martin Short. Perhaps your eight year old can also explain to you that Lowndes was not competing against one RED car this weekend but 4. Under those circumstances I believe anybody else would have "lost it" completely.

The sad reality is that Lowndes has been "off colour" since his Bathurst win. Given that he showed so much emotion over the passing a true "RED" legend I think it highlights the qualities the man has. On the other side of the fence the current crop of "RED" drivers have moved on very quickly. As a family man I know which "values" I would want my kids to have. Sorry Martin sometimes the reality of live overtakes even the greatest of sporting achievements.

[beast]

Go back to the points system they had in 1987

20,15,12,10,8,6,4,3,2,1.

Remember 1987. Jim Richards won 4 races, Glenn Seton won 3 and George Fury won the other and guess what.

They were 1st, 2nd and 3rd in points at the end of the series.

[brchi17]

.....I wonder if Roland did end up lodging that protest? If he did it should be an interesting week.

I was talking about this with some mates at the track & seeing Rick was given a drive-thru, on what grounds would/could Roland appeal on (had Rick not being given a drive-thru then he may have had a case) ???

The fact that Rick was given & served a penalty for the contact of Lowndes (I'm not calling it a punt as from the very little footage I've seen I do wonder if Lowndes was a touch hot for that corner anyway) wouldn't giving Rick another penalty after the race weekend constitute double jeopardy ???

[beast]

Beast, ud get a job with CAMS in no time ;)

I'm probably to severe for them.

Oh well, their loss.

[xa351gt]

are you for real?

ABSOLUTELY,
All motorsports need to make the penalties for these so severe that drivers will refrain from taking on those tactics. I would feel the exact same way ifit had been the other way around. To reward poor sportsmanship sends a dangerous message.I think any techincal infractions should also be met with severe penalties. I watched a rules cheat win the NASCAR championship and make a joke of that championship as well.

[00lowndes]

Shame on you holden shame. Have you ever seen so many bad sportmanship flags for so call top drivers.PLEASE EXPLAIN. I feel sorry for holden fans having to celebrate this way. I think all points should not be counted for Lowndes or Kelly in the last race and this would mean we have a draw and to champions.This is coming from a Holden supporter and a Lowndes Fan.

[lukey73]

I was talking about this with some mates at the track & seeing Rick was given a drive-thru, on what grounds would/could Roland appeal on (had Rick not being given a drive-thru then he may have had a case) ???

The fact that Rick was given & served a penalty for the contact of Lowndes (I'm not calling it a punt as from the very little footage I've seen I do wonder if Lowndes was a touch hot for that corner anyway). Wouldn't giving Rick another penalty after the race weekend be a lot like double jeopardy ???

Not sure, they were talking about it during the telecast that he had signed some form of protest sheet which may have been lodged depending on the outcome of the stewards meeting after race 3.

I suppose someone would have to have access to the rule book to see if there are grounds to lodge an appeal. I really is such a sad way to have the series finish after what has generally been a good yrs racing. :(

[beast]

Shame on you holden shame. Have you ever seen so many bad sportmanship flags for so call top drivers.PLEASE EXPLAIN. I feel sorry for holden fans having to celebrate this way. I think all points should not be counted for Lowndes or Kelly in the last race and this would mean we have a draw and to champions.This is coming from a Holden supporter and a Lowndes Fan.

Lowndes would have won the title then because he has round wins.

[inter]

Let me tell you , i am not happy that Rick Kelly is Champion,
Reasons, I dont personally Like him ( he has done no wrong to me) and I am a ford Fan.
But....

I dont think he took out Lowndes intentionally........and also Lowndes should have been black flagget for driving a potentially dangerous machine so Kelly would of finished a head of him in race three any way.

having said that what Gt and skaife did in the previous races was abismal.
If racing was left to racing rick would have not started that hight up in the third race and hence this would have not happened.

Ps is kelly official champion or can it be taken away?

[lukey73]

CAN PEOPLE PLEASE STOP PUTTING ALL HOLDEN SUPPORTERS IN ONE BASKET AND ALL FORD SUPPORTERS IN ANOTHER!

I AM A HOLDEN SUPPORTER BUT DONT LIKE THE WAY IN WHICH A HOLDEN HAS WON THE CHAMPIONSHIP. THE CORRECT WAY IS TO RELATE TO THE TEAMS/DRIVERS NOT THE MANUFACTURER, I DIDNT SEE SCAR / TASMAN / PERKINS / PMM OR NASH RACING EFFECT THE OUTCOME OF TODAYS EVENTS. :mad:

[00lowndes]

Forget round wins the only way this is going to keep both sides happy is to call it a draw as both are deserving champoins when they drive professionaly. Not this punt crap. Bring on 2007 as I'm so over this poor result for the final race of the great 2006 we had.

[beast]

CAN PEOPLE PLEASE STOP PUTTING ALL HOLDEN SUPPORTERS IN ONE BASKET AND ALL FORD SUPPORTERS IN ANOTHER!

I AM A HOLDEN SUPPORTER BUT DONT LIKE THE WAY IN WHICH A HOLDEN HAS WON THE CHAMPIONSHIP. THE CORRECT WAY IS TO RELATE TO THE TEAMS/DRIVERS NOT THE MANUFACTURER, I DIDNT SEE SCAR / TASMAN / PERKINS / PMM OR NASH RACING EFFECT THE OUTCOME OF TODAYS EVENTS. :mad:

Couldn't have said it better myself.

I'm a holden supporter, i drive a holden but todays tactics were disgraceful.

Maybe we should turn next years championship to have HT Monaros and XW Falcons in the series. on the tyres that they used in the sixties and then lets see whos the champion.

[05shan]

ABSOLUTELY,
All motorsports need to make the penalties for these so severe that drivers will refrain from taking on those tactics. I would feel the exact same way ifit had been the other way around. To reward poor sportsmanship sends a dangerous message.I think any techincal infractions should also be met with severe penalties. I watched a rules cheat win the NASCAR championship and make a joke of that championship as well.
So you are saying RK intended to turn Lowndes around and intended Davidson to hit him and damage his car???:rolleyes:
Come on, it was a little tap. Both parties should shoulder some of the responsibility for that one;)

[AmonFan]

Well i guess we will know the outcome tomorrow afternoon......

[Martin Thomas]

Sort of explains why TW is a "hero" in the red paddock when you read comments like those of Martin Short. Perhaps your eight year old can also explain to you that Lowndes was not competing against one RED car this weekend but 4. Under those circumstances I believe anybody else would have "lost it" completely.

The sad reality is that Lowndes has been "off colour" since his Bathurst win. Given that he showed so much emotion over the passing a true "RED" legend I think it highlights the qualities the man has. On the other side of the fence the current crop of "RED" drivers have moved on very quickly. As a family man I know which "values" I would want my kids to have. Sorry Martin sometimes the reality of live overtakes even the greatest of sporting achievements.

Martin Thomas. Not Nick Short. Flattering though it is..
And I'm very happy with my Kids values. Honesty, looking at the facts and making their own mind up is much encouraged in this house. If you don't agree with me, fine. But don't think you can make judgements on my values, you don't even know my star sign.:D

[Martin Thomas]

Perhaps your eight year old can also explain to you that Lowndes was not competing against one RED car this weekend but 4.

4??? Asked my 8 year old and he remembers at least 12. I thought there were more than 4 as well. Might go check.;)

[05shan]

Well i guess we will know the outcome tomorrow afternoon......
That soon:)
The way "Stiffey the pressure cooker" was talking we wouldnt know for weeks:cool:

[AmonFan]

Willsy's opinion is interesting on the myspace blog..... http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=us er.viewprofile&friendid=67331600 scroll down to his comment...... i love the quote about the series ;)

[XA Craig]

http://www.v8supercar.com.au/news/latestnews/newsd isplay.asp?Ind=M&gid=23147480

[AmonFan]

That soon:)
The way "Stiffey the pressure cooker" was talking we wouldnt know for weeks:cool:

Well the hearing is tomorrow, hopefully we get an outcome same day

[beast]

Well the hearing is tomorrow, hopefully we get an outcome same day

Wonder if they will show the hearing live.

[brchi17]

Well the hearing is tomorrow, hopefully we get an outcome same day

so does this effect the result of the championship ?

[05shan]

Sad way for it to end. Have to wait till tommorrow to finally put it to rest;)

[AmonFan]

so does this effect the result of the championship ?

Well i guess if they feel a larger penalty should be applied, exclusion from the final race?, then Craig would win..... Having been in hearing's before, lol Craig is still in with a shot...

[ratbag-racing]

Did i miss something while i was at bingo,was there a race somewhere ?

[brchi17]

Well i guess if they feel a larger penalty should be applied, exclusion from the final race?, then Craig would win..... Having been in hearing's before, lol Craig is still in with a shot...

As I said earlier I was at the top end of the track & didn't see the race on the telly, just the stuff on the news & from that footage it looks like CL could of been a little hot for that corner anyway.

I know we'll never know if he would have made the corner of not (had he and Rick not touched), but it was something I was thinking when I saw the footage for a 2nd time.

[05shan]

As I said earlier I was at the top end of the track & didn't see the race on the telly, just the stuff on the news & from that footage it looks like CL could of been a little hot for that corner anyway.

I know we'll never know if he would have made the corner of not (had he and Rick not touched), but it was something I was thinking when I saw the footage for a 2nd time.
Agree, i was thinking the same. Thats all un-important now, due to the incident.;)

[lukey73]

As I said earlier I was at the top end of the track & didn't see the race on the telly, just the stuff on the news & from that footage it looks like CL could of been a little hot for that corner anyway.

I know we'll never know if he would have made the corner of not (had he and Rick not touched), but it was something I was thinking when I saw the footage for a 2nd time.

Watching it again to me it looks like Craig was inside of Todd trying to unsettle him, now if that was the case and he couldnt pass on the exit of the hairpin and Rick did the smart thing and stayed out of Craig's boot he could have slipped in behind his brother and passed Craig on the exit of Sibera for "clean" pass.

[singer]

I was very dissappointed that the outcome came down to hit'n'bash rather than a championship decided on driving skills:(

[Holden2003]

The most frustrating thing out of this weekend is we have learned another technical term. Most of us for many years were used to " B Pillar". Then we had to get used to "Racing Room". Now we got "Blocking". Very Very Grey these rules are becoming.

[BILLFORD1]

I seem to recall some of the girls on the 'lion team' saying they would help ricky the punter win the championship however they could. Just a bit sad the depths to which 'sportsmanship' & playing within the rules has sunk to...Perhaps the trophy should go to 'them in the tower' seeing as they pretty much determined the outcome over the course of the season ?? They will be flatout in the off season trying to formulate a rule book everyone understands & agrees upon. At the moment there's 57 interpretations of every rubbery rule !! It at least means more money for classic models of the past for me, no more v8 stuporcars for my cabinet !! Roll on Daytona !! :D

[brchi17]

The most frustrating thing out of this weekend is we have learned another technical term. Most of us for many years were used to " B Pillar". Then we had to get used to "Racing Room". Now we got "Blocking". Very Very Grey these rules are becoming.

Very true & if we 'enthusiasts' are having trouble trying to understand the rules then I really feel for the once a year watches of our sport.......some of the leaders at the top of this series need to feel the wrath of a size 12 IMHO :rolleyes:

[bargs35]

The drama over Rick Kelly's final race incident at Phillip Island with Craig Lowndes is not yet over, with a final decision on the matter to be taken at a Stewards' hearing on Monday.

Following the third race of the weekend, in which contact on lap two at Honda Hairpin between Lowndes and Kelly saw Kelly given a drive-through penalty, the Investigating and Prosecuting Officer (IPO) Peter Wollerman viewed further footage of the incident and arrived at a final decision.

"The penalty was based on a determination by the stewards that there was a breach of the rules in terms of careless driving by Rick Kelly. After some further consideration the matter was further considered by the IPO of the race," said chief steward Steve Chopping.

"He considered a great deal of data, in car footage and other things concerning the in-car activities of car 15 and car 888 and whilst the IPO investigated those things Triple Eight lodged a protest against the penalty imposed in the race.

"Now that the IPO has determined that the matter doesn't warrant being referred to the stewards for further penalty the stewards will now refer to the hearing of the Triple Eight protest."

Lowndes' team Triple Eight Race Engineering disagreed with the decision that it didn't warrant further review by the stewards, and so Triple Eight's protest means the matter will be heard at a Stewards' hearing on Monday at midday, at a venue yet to be determined.

2006 V8 Supercar champion Rick Kelly was not surprised about the investigation, considering the closeness of the fight: "It's not the ideal way to win the Championship. With the amount riding on it I fully expect that any small incident that has an effect on the Championship that they would look into it."

Meanwhile, Ford's motorsport manager Ray Price was unhappy with the decision, considering the effect the initial incident had on the championship result: "We felt we were hard done by. We believe that there is probably a difference between a racing incident that may cost a race win or a meeting win is different to one that costs a Championship."

source: autosport.com

Time will tell...

[beast]

Very true & if we 'enthusiasts' are having trouble trying to understand the rules then I really feel for the once a year watches of our sport.......some of the leaders at the top of this series need to feel the wrath of a size 12 IMHO :rolleyes:

Yep. It has really turned stupid now. Don't think i will be watching next year after this.

But then again, i will probably change my mind before then.

[gab73]

Just drove past Clayton and there was uncle Tom with the championship trophy and an angle grinder cutting it into 4 equal portions.
He then went on to present a quarter of the trophy to each Skaifey, Toddler, Garth no fuel pressure Tander, and Rick Schumacher

[wayno]

Just drove past Clayton and there was uncle Tom with the championship trophy and an angle grinder cutting it into 4 equal portions.
He then went on to present a quarter of the trophy to each Skaifey, Toddler, Garth no fuel pressure Tander, and Rick Schumacher

Yawn! Is your hand getting tired yet? :rolleyes: Wait for the stewards hearing. If Rick is stripped of this I think it will be a joke.
A protest has been put in, so a hearing has to be had. Let's all wait until tomorrow. If Rick does lose it then TW will have to have a welder handy! :D

[GRPIII]

do anyone of you one eyed ford supporters no the meaning of TEAMMATES?
or just HOLDEN TEAMATES.
in every form of motorsport this does happen.
get over it. maybe if jamie was a little faster he would have done the same for craig.
ambrose had the same problem a few years back.

[cooper1117]

do anyone of you one eyed ford supporters no the meaning of TEAMMATES?
or just HOLDEN TEAMATES.
in every form of motorsport this does happen.
get over it. maybe if jamie was a little faster he would have done the same for craig.
ambrose had the same problem a few years back.

no I dont know!!!

So that would be like playing footy and having a teammate hold the jumper of another team player so I could kick the winning goal or score the winning try. A teammate who took a dive in a soccer game so I could kick the penality goal. A teammate who in cycling blocks and pushes potential threat so I can cross the line first.

Yes teammates. Not an excuse to change the true outcome of a race. By the way I am a holden man - not a one eyed ford fan. I do not agree with Tanders tatics, amazing how quick he was in race 3 compared to race 2. Oh thats right the fuel pick up.

[billybanana]

Craig has never punted anybody off through out 2006.


He's far from a cleanskin. Ask Jason Richards - he could have ended up in the morgue from Lowndes antics at Indy this year.

[CowboyMatt]

Regardless of the outcome of the stewards enquiry the championship is going to be remembered more what happened in Race 3 than anything else which is a shame.

I think the HRT tactics were a disgrace.

No doubt Skaife tried to punt Lowndes off in Race 1 and Tander gave himself up in a post-race interview after Race 2. Amazing how the fuel problem cleared itself after the bad sportsmanship flag only to miraculously occur again a few laps later.

Unfortunately we'll never know what would have happened in Race 3 if Lowndes hadn't been hit from behind.

[rex555]

I'm neither a Holden or a Ford fan, I just like good motor racing. Until yesterday I would have been as happy to see T.Kelly, Tander, Lowndes, Frosty, Bright etc etc win the championship, but yesterdays 'racing' just left a bad taste in my mouth. Yes Rick may have won, but the question will always remain "Could he have done it cleanly?". I don't believe so given the difference in speed in the cars in race 2, but now we will never know. Regardless of the outcome from the stewards today, there will always be people on both sides of the fence who won't consider the driver with No1 on the door to be a 'real' champion next year.

[TIC-302]

Quote from Ray Price:

"In terms of fair play over the three races this weekend I'm not convinced that we saw that. The fact that we had bad sportsmanship flags for Garth Tander and Mark Skaife for blocking, as well as a black flag for Tander for the same offence is a clear indication of this.

"Ford could not be any prouder of the efforts of Craig Lowndes and the entire Triple Eight Race Engineering operation. They have competed hard and fair throughout the entire season. The fact is that Lowndes won four rounds and Triple Eight won five all up this year, including victory at Bathurst.

"Despite what we have seen this weekend, Ford will continue to encourage hard but fair racing."

Roll on 07

[brchi17]

Keep it clean fellas

[lxss383]

ABSOLUTELY,
All motorsports need to make the penalties for these so severe that drivers will refrain from taking on those tactics. I would feel the exact same way ifit had been the other way around. To reward poor sportsmanship sends a dangerous message.I think any techincal infractions should also be met with severe penalties. I watched a rules cheat win the NASCAR championship and make a joke of that championship as well.


mate in my eyes, and i could be wrong, but rick kelly had a look on the inside line, and probably shouldnt have made contact, however unfortunate it was, that sent him and incidentally his brother todd spinning. that simple act of driver error on ricks behalf, was penalised, with a drive through penalty, which in my personal opinion was harsh. if they wanted to take out car contact, then why dont we just have qualifying, and a top ten shoot out, and leave it at that. the quickest time decides the winner.....wont happen, cause no one would want to see it. how ever it was unfortunate that lowndesy got cleaned up by another car, which is what put him out of the race. and from memory, lowndes got away from that incident in front of todd kelly, but do you see todd kelly protesting ricks driving....no, and he had another race win in front of him. it was just unfortunate that lowndes got hit, or he would have won the championship if he hadnt suffered damage to his car as he would have been in front of rick kelly, with rick copping a drive through penalty. thats my opinion. i dont think that there was any dangerous driving involved. and as for the blocking that tander was performing, it wouldnt have mattered either way, as there wasnt enough time for lowndes to catch and pass winterbottom, and im sure if he had gotten past tander, that tander wouldnt have stopped rick from getting passed him. i would be very suprised if anything comes of the protest.

[Leigh]

OK. I'm neither Red nor Blue when it comes to manufacturer allegiance, but am a strong Lowndes fan, and although Rick's driving has impressed me, his driving tactics have never really impressed me...he is a lot better than that!

Allegiances declared, and having not seen the incident as yet, I think it is a great shame that the racing was not clean...but, given that Rick, guilty or not, has served the exact same penalty that every other driver found guilty of punting a driver off has received this year, then Rick is the deserving Champion.

One thing is for certain...neither driver will be as happy to have their name on the trophy as they would have been had it been a clean race...

That aside, Triple8 had to put in a protest...there were cattle stations on the line yesterday, and for Triple8 to not protest, they may well have lost their's...by protesting, they may well just get to keep their cattle station, regardless of the outcome of the tribunal...

[cooper1117]

and as for the blocking that tander was performing, it wouldnt have mattered either way, as there wasnt enough time for lowndes to catch and pass winterbottom, and im sure if he had gotten past tander, that tander wouldnt have stopped rick from getting passed him. i would be very suprised if anything comes of the protest.

That's the point isn't it. Tander blocked Lowndes, and if Lowndes got passed by pulling off a risky move the first thing Tander would have done is pulled straight over and made the easiest of easiest passes for Rick. Thus in lies the issue. Tander had a quick enough car to actually challenge Todd for the round victory, maybe he should have concentrated on that and let Rick and Craig duke it out fair and square. The four HSV/HRT drivers changed the race dynamics. As shown at Indy, the Ford drivers were all racing for themselves, which is what we all want to see. No one wants a championship served up to someone on a platter, they are special, you need to earn them.

Lets also point out that if Tander got the points Rick got in the two enduros (as he should have stayed in that car) then Tander would have had a 100 point gap on both Rick and Craig. Tander would have been a more worthy championship winner, but as I said before I was disappointed in his tatics in race 2.

[Leigh]

Lets also point out that if Tander got the points Rick got in the two enduros (as he should have stayed in that car) then Tander would have had a 100 point gap on both Rick and Craig. Tander would have been a more worthy championship winner, but as I said before I was disappointed in his tatics in race 2.
IF Rick and Tander had have been paired for the enduro's, they would have been in a different car entirely!

So roll a dice for the outcome!!!

All ifs, buts and maybes and completely off topic!

[f1webber]

I'm neither a Holden or a Ford fan, I just like good motor racing. Until yesterday I would have been as happy to see T.Kelly, Tander, Lowndes, Frosty, Bright etc etc win the championship, but yesterdays 'racing' just left a bad taste in my mouth. Yes Rick may have won, but the question will always remain "Could he have done it cleanly?". I don't believe so given the difference in speed in the cars in race 2, but now we will never know. Regardless of the outcome from the stewards today, there will always be people on both sides of the fence who won't consider the driver with No1 on the door to be a 'real' champion next year.

Well said...........
Anyway it is done and dusted now so lets all move on and see what 07 brings.
We will have new TV,Points and a whole lot of driver swaps so it should be a cracker.

[monarocveightz]

I am a Holden fan, but i don't believe what happened should have happened. I think Holden were desperate to win something as they had lost Bathurst. I don't think that it was raced cleanly and fairly. If Brocky was watching i think he would have been ashamed that certain drivers were blocking others to stuff up there chance of winning.

Lets hope 07 will be raced cleanly.

[lukey73]

. I think Holden were desperate to win something as they had lost Bathurst.
.

Its not Holden, TW management group lets make that clear. Do you really think Holden would want this sort of bad feeling towards them?

[monarocveightz]

Its not Holden, TW management group lets make that clear. Do you really think Holden would want this sort of bad feeling towards them?


No Holden wouldn't want bad publicity

[CowboyMatt]

Anyone kow what time the enquiry is?

[lukey73]

12pm, but dont think we will anything till atleast 6pm if at all today

[Dingo]

12pm, but dont think we will anything till atleast 6pm if at all today
Wouldn't want to be too late - isn't the Grand Poobah and His Loyal Subjects having a Bash Royale this evening at Packer's place?

[TIC-302]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

As for the argument about Lowndes blocking - if it is OK to punt someone off because they are blocking Lowndes would have wone races one and two. The IPO decided that Lowndes was being hampered by kelly's (doesn't deserve uppercase) teammates - Lowndes didn't clean them up.

How can you take pride in winning a championship through an action that was deemed illegal? Take pride in this at a huge risk of negative public perception.

SHAME - holden
SHAME - kelly

[Leigh]

...and that's where the Champion receives their trophy...so it would be a bit of a downer on that function if it couldn't be handed over;)

[GRPIII]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

As for the argument about Lowndes blocking - if it is OK to punt someone off because they are blocking Lowndes would have wone races one and two. The IPO decided that Lowndes was being hampered by kelly's (doesn't deserve uppercase) teammates - Lowndes didn't clean them up.

How can you take pride in winning a championship through an action that was deemed illegal? Take pride in this at a huge risk of negative public perception.

SHAME - holden
SHAME - kelly
the championship was over 32 races not just race 3 at philip island, knowing that he finished ever race & had a higher average finishing postion than anyone else should give rick all the pride he needs.
maybe its craigs & 888 fault they didnt win, the didnt finish one race of the season, that finish would have given him the few points he needed, stop blaming rick, craig should have finished higher up the pecking order at a few other rounds. indy for one, even bar the penalties he didnt qualify near the front so i suppose that ricks or hrts fault too.
one incident doesnt make up the championship.

[TIC-302]

one incident doesnt make up the championship.

no, but it did decide the champoinship.

You Holden supporters must be realy proud to have Rick as the champion!?

[Malik]

just for interest...

couple of IF's for everyone...


IF they find that the penalty wasn't enough and take away points...

they would need to penalise Kelly more then 37 points for Lowndes to become champion....

so let's say

IF they find him guilty..
IF they use Ambrose's penalty as a guide and dock him 25 points...

Kelly will still be champion...

[TIC-302]

just for interest...

couple of IF's for everyone...


IF they find that the penalty wasn't enough and take away points...

they would need to penalise Kelly more then 37 points for Lowndes to become champion....

so let's say

IF they find him guilty..
IF they use Ambrose's penalty as a guide and dock him 25 points...

Kelly will still be champion...


The points system was different then !! you will find that using the same penalty figures and numbers, the new points penalty would be 37.5 !!!

25 points was the equivelent to 12.5 positions

now 12.5 positions would be equal to 37.5 points. amazing really isnt it

interesting hey !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[rex555]

Easy fixed, disqualify them both as too hard and give it to the guy that came 3rd in the championship. :D

[GRPIII]

no, but it did decide the champoinship.
maybe race 2 at barhain decided the title or race 1 at indy.
you must be narrow minded if you think the title is decided by one race of 32?
remember its a championship not a single race.

[Malik]

Im gonna play devils advocate here a little (mainly cos I can)

and before anyone flames me for being a "holden sheep" I am not making any excuses for saying that Kelly is the champ blah blah blah... just giving an interesting opinion..


After watching the incident again (and again and again and again) WHAT IF.... instead of what everyone is automatically saying is that Kelly punted lowndes to ensure a win etc etc..

What if Lowndes for whatever reason decided when he felt Kellys car giving him some nudges that he would just take a bit of pressure off the brakes... knowning that he could bounce off Toddler and essentially continue the race while Rick got a drive through for the punt..

now the only problem for Lowndsey is that he spun and got nailed by Davison... bugger... but it was a risk he took from the start...


personally I am quite **** off that every forum regarding supercars basically has said that Rick is the bad guy and that he isnt a deserving champion for what HE did to lowndes... but did anyone stop to think that Lowndes did it to himself trying to get Rick penalised out of the race? I mean a drive through at that stage if Lowndes had of been able to continue racing would have handed the championship to lowndes....



oh... Let the flaming begin... Im expecting it.


OH.. the other thing Im sick of seeing EVERYWHERE is that Rick isnt deserving cos he didnt get a round win and only 1 race win.... what a load of carp..

Round wins are symbolic only... for the guy with the most points for the weekend.. how many round wins have been handed out to people with 3 second places for the weekend?

and accumulating points was ok for Ingall last year... but not ok for kelly this year? another load of carp (lots of fish on this board hey)

[brchi17]

I still wonder if (and it's a big if that can never be answered), Lowndes was every going to make the corner before the contact with Rick ???

I'd like to see the data (which will never happen as well) from CL's car because that should/could be able to answer this question, which I think would/could place a whole new light onto the subject.....

[CowboyMatt]

you must be narrow minded if you think the title is decided by one race of 32?
remember its a championship not a single race.

All tied after 31 races - sounds like the title comes down to the last race to me.

[SWRT]

To reply to bananabill, Lowndes may have hit Jason Richards at Indy, but DID NOT PASS HIM, which was the sporting thing.
The fairest pently would be
a) take both Rick and craigs race 3 points off
b) take Ricks race 3 points off
or c) take Ricks Round 13 points off - and wala a Ford 1-2.

[Leigh]

the championship was over 32 races not just race 3 at philip island, knowing that he finished ever race & had a higher average finishing postion than anyone else should give rick all the pride he needs.
maybe its craigs & 888 fault they didnt win, the didnt finish one race of the season, that finish would have given him the few points he needed, stop blaming rick, craig should have finished higher up the pecking order at a few other rounds. indy for one, even bar the penalties he didnt qualify near the front so i suppose that ricks or hrts fault too.
one incident doesnt make up the championship.
I think that just highlights the farce that the points system is...I don't think anybody really wants the person who "averages" highest to be champion...

But then, if you look at the results, I think you'll find that Craig finished races "on-average" higher than Rick...the silly weighted points system does not reflect this though...

But I agree, the championship was certainly not lost in the final round...there have been many incidents during the year that could have seen either of them with more or less points...

One thing is for certain though, the TWR empire certainly does have the very best tactician:p

[CowboyMatt]

OH.. the other thing Im sick of seeing EVERYWHERE is that Rick isnt deserving cos he didnt get a round win and only 1 race win.... what a load of carp..

Round wins are symbolic only... for the guy with the most points for the weekend.. how many round wins have been handed out to people with 3 second places for the weekend?

and accumulating points was ok for Ingall last year... but not ok for kelly this year? another load of carp (lots of fish on this board hey)

Rick played the system - it's been known all year he'd sacrifice wins for points. Ingall did the same last year and I didn't like that either.

Change the points system - make wins worth more and points in general harder to get (stop giving points for the 200th place getter) and you'll have drivers going for wins instead of circulating to accumulate points.

[lxss383]

WELL DONE RICK KELLY, YOUR ARE THE CHAMPION.

maybe next year lowndsey. at least you got Bathurst hey.

[CowboyMatt]

One thing is for certain though, the TWR empire certainly does have the very best tactician:p


I wouldn't call bad sportsmanship good tactics.

[Malik]

To reply to bananabill, Lowndes may have hit Jason Richards at Indy, but DID NOT PASS HIM, which was the sporting thing.
The fairest pently would be
a) take both Rick and craigs race 3 points off
b) take Ricks race 3 points off
or c) take Ricks Round 13 points off - and wala a Ford 1-2.

and funilly enough all three of those options give Lowndes the championship...

[Leigh]

I wouldn't call bad sportsmanship good tactics.
Who did?

Craig charged through the pack in the reverse grid races while Kelly bided his time. Although Lowndes finished "on-average" higher, he did not get the corresponding points and hence TWR made the better tactical call...as was evidenced by Kelly being in a position to strike at championships end!

[CowboyMatt]

Who did?

Craig charged through the pack in the reverse grid races while Kelly bided his time. Although Lowndes finished "on-average" higher, he did not get the corresponding points and hence TWR made the better tactical call...as was evidenced by Kelly being in a position to strike at championships end!

I thought you were only referring to Philip Island....point(s) taken.

[GRPIII]

But I agree, the championship was certainly not lost in the final round...there have been many incidents during the year that could have seen either of them with more or less points...

excatly what im trying to get across.
yes i agree the whole v8 circus need a complete overhaul from points to penalties to tyres, aero etc etc.
kelly is a deserved champion, he played the points system the right way, as did rusty last year.
funny how the 2 guys fighting for the title had no poles, yet the guy with the most poles & equal amount of race wins was way down the pecking order.
proves the guy who won the title was not the quickest & the quickest guy was not reliable.
but a championship is about racking points up, wether it be first place a few times or plenty of minor places.

[Dingo]

Better idea - let's just cancel the whole championship for 2006 - that way everybody will be happy and no one's feelings will get hurt! :mad: :mad: :mad:

[cooper1117]

Follow the format set out in CARS the movie. Disqualify LNOWdes and Kelly from race 3, they end up on same points. Go to a decider race just with the two contenders. It worked in CARS could work in reality:D

Although Chick took out The King to win!!!!!!!:rolleyes:

[LC Torana]

Some people need to stop looking through Lowndes coloured glasses.....

[CowboyMatt]

Some people need to stop looking through Lowndes coloured glasses.....


We'd be having exactly the same discussion if Race 3 happened the other way around.

[Malik]

Exactly.....

Ford supporters are going to be wearing blue glasses..

Holden supporters are going to be wearing red glasses...

and then there will be the fence sitters who are waiting for the official word this afternoon.

[brchi17]

We'd be having exactly the same discussion if Race 3 happened the other way around.

Are we really having a discussion ???

I was beginning to wonder if it was more like a name calling exercise, the sort of thing you'd see in your local school yard playground :rolleyes:

It's sad that some people can discuss this with constructive, well thought out argument. Sure lets be passionate about our sides and our point of view, but lets do it constructively without the need for petty name calling and insults.

[00lowndes]

I'M A HOLDEN SUPPORTER FIRST AND A LOWNDES FAN/SUPPORTER. i AM ASHAMED TO WIN THE CHAMPIONSHIP THIS WAY AND SO SHOULD RICK. AS MOST HOLDEN SUPPORTER ARE ASHAMED. MAKES A MAN WONT TO JUMP SHIP. YOU CAN SEE WHY SO MANY DRIVER GO TO THE BLUE SIDE. THEY RACE AS RACER NOT UNDER TEAM ORDERS. AS FOR NO BLOCKING IN RACE 3 I THINK YOU SHOULD LOOK AT TK PACE AND HOW EASY HE PULLED AWAY IN RACE1 & 2 BUT RACE 3 HE COULDN'T PULL AWAY WHILE LOWNDES WAS BEHIND AND YOUNGER BRO NEXT. IT MAKES YOU WOUNDER DID LOWNDES HAVE A BETTER CAR FOR THIS RACE OR WAS TK HELPING BRO

[TIC-302]

totally agree

[GRPIII]

better to be a proud winner, than a sore loser.
build a bridge and get over it.
do you ever think craig may regret leaving holden, imagine the titles he could have had if he stayed with the general, its either the money or winning.

[BIGJIM]

better to be a proud winner, than a sore loser.
build a bridge and get over it.
do you ever think craig may regret leaving holden, imagine the titles he could have had if he stayed with the general, its either the money or winning.

How could Dick Kelly be a proud winner with all the team tactics over the weekend. I dont think CL regrets leaving, i believe he has blue blood, considering the fact he has had his FORD cortina locked away in his garage for many years. Holden just gave him a start.

[Leigh]

How could Dick Kelly be a proud winner with all the team tactics over the weekend. I dont think CL regrets leaving, i believe he has blue blood, considering the fact he has had his FORD cortina locked away in his garage for many years. Holden just gave him a start.
Gee, that's proof!

So what colour blood does Skaife have? Or Dick Johnson? Or Seton? Careful how you answer this because I reckon you'll get it wrong on most counts!

[AmonFan]

Gee, that's proof!

So what colour blood does Skaife have? Or Dick Johnson? Or Seton? Careful how you answer this because I reckon you'll get it wrong on most counts!

IIRC as far as first race cars go, Skaife in a LJ Torana Sports Sedan, Seto in a Escort Sports Sedan and DJ in a FJ? not sure what cars they have stashed in the sheds though.....

[lukey73]

Exactly.....

Ford supporters are going to be wearing blue glasses..

Holden supporters are going to be wearing red glasses...

and then there will be the fence sitters who are waiting for the official word this afternoon.


No there not! I am a Holden supporter but am not happy at what the TWG of cars did over the weekend, if they keep the Trophy i hope they enjoy it as they will have lost one supporter here. :mad:

[zeev8]

Hi all,
Just heard on Foxsports news that the Triple Eight protest has been dismissed after a 4 hr hearing thus making championship result official.
regards Steve.

[05shan]

Wondering if the majority of Kelly bashers would be whinging this hard if it wasnt the last race?
He served his punishment on a questionable decision and got on with it.
Why didnt 888 try and see what was wrong with Lowndes car???
It was just unlucky that Lowndes got hit by Davidson. Hence ruining his plans to win his first crown with the blue boys.
Loyal fans on both sides will never agree on this one.

[05shan]

Hi all,
Just heard on Foxsports news that the Triple Eight protest has been dismissed after a 4 hr hearing thus making championship result official.
regards Steve.
Great news RICK IS CHAMPION.
Better get used to it guys:p :D

[GRPIII]

stop using the blocking thing its starting to get boring, yes skaife & tander held lowndes up, but im 100% sure whincupp would do the same for lowndes.
remember its a team sport.

[CowboyMatt]

Hi all,
Just heard on Foxsports news that the Triple Eight protest has been dismissed after a 4 hr hearing thus making championship result official.
regards Steve.


Regardless of all we've argued back and forth I think this was the only decision we were ever going to get.

If the protest had been upheld all hell would have broken loose from the Walkinshaw team - it would have ended up in the courts.

A sad way to end the championship and my guess is it will now be remembered for the Race 3 incident more than anything else.

[Leigh]

If the protest had been upheld all hell would have broken loose from the Walkinshaw team - it would have ended up in the courts.
So your saying that V8SA are scared of Walkinshaw?

[05shan]

stop using the blocking thing its starting to get boring, yes skaife & tander held lowndes up, but im 100% sure whincupp would do the same for lowndes.
.
Of course he would have, that is what team mates do;)

[CowboyMatt]

So your saying that V8SA are scared of Walkinshaw?

No - I'm saying it would have led to counter-protest and counter-protest and ended up in court. Then it would have gone to the High Court, then the Supreme Court and on and on.

[AmonFan]

Im suddenly thinking our Hyper Series could turn pretty ugly :p if Kelly gets a drive though for a tap on lowndes what is the penalty Wayno gets each time he drills leigh :p does he have to hop out the car, grab a beer and then jump back in?

[Leigh]

Im suddenly thinking our Hyper Series could turn pretty ugly :p if Kelly gets a drive though for a tap on lowndes what is the penalty Wayno gets each time he drills leigh :p does he have to hop out the car, grab a beer and then jump back in?
What, and reward him!!!!!

[the_goldie]

Alot of this makes me laugh. Skaife, Tander blocking -- how dare they... I would do the same thing to help out a fellow team-mate / friend or driver in the same brand as me. I can't believe you guys don't think Whincup would have done the same thing for Lowndes if he was able to in any of the 3 races.

Bright and Wnterbottom didn't care because they were trying to beat 888 to get 2nd in the teams championship so they would not have cared if Lowndes came 1st or last!!!

Skaife and Tander cared because they obviously wanted to help out Rick and Holden to get #1 back on the car.

If Lowndes was good enough he would have passed Skaife and Tander, sure they may have been on the racing line but they were quicker in other parts of the track where Lowndes wasn't so boo hoo, 1 car was quicker in a certain part of the track where it just happened to be a part where you could pass if you were good enough.

Now if Davison had not of ploughed into the side of Lowndes this discussion probably would not be happening as Lowndes would have won and Rick would have copped a drive through -- which I still don't think was that fair as I have seen worse love taps not get penalised, but anyway whats done is done and it seems as if the verdict is out and Rick is now #1 -- congrats and he kept his head even after the drive through penalty, and did what the points system rewards - which again every other driver and team out there knows what the point system is and if they were as consistant as Rick maybe there would have been more drivers competing for that #1 on their car next year...

Can't wait for race 1 at Clipsal next year :D

[CowboyMatt]

Skaife and Tander cared because they obviously wanted to help out Rick and Holden to get #1 back on the car.



Two Bad Sportsmanship Flags and a drive-through and you don't think it's wrong?

[Pedro]

It was just reported on seven news that Kelly Has won the championship and triple eight were considering another appeal.

[CowboyMatt]

It was just reported on seven news that Kelly Has won the championship and triple eight were considering another appeal.


Just what we don't need - what could they appeal over that would not have been covered today?

[GRPIII]

Two Bad Sportsmanship Flags and a drive-through and you don't think it's wrong?again this type of thing has happened all year, he blocked he got a drive-thru, done the crime done the time.

[Pedro]

again this type of thing has happened all year, he blocked he got a drive-thru, done the crime done the time.
Totally agree how can you be penalised again for the same thing?

[HRT 1-2]

They just had a statement from Lowndes on the radio and he said they aren't going to take it any further!

[CowboyMatt]

again this type of thing has happened all year, he blocked he got a drive-thru, done the crime done the time.


Not disagreeing with you but with the championship on the line and the HRT approach so obvoius it was always going to be controversial.

I'm not a Holden of Ford supporter, nor do I support any particular driver over another.

My heroes have all retired and I watch it now because it's like walking and talking for me - part of who I am.

I don't believe the HRT approach kept with the true spirit of motor racing - just the same as other incidents by other drivers this year or in any other year.

[inter]

totally agree
someone got banned????

[inter]

Gee, that's proof!

So what colour blood does Skaife have? Or Dick Johnson? Or Seton? Careful how you answer this because I reckon you'll get it wrong on most counts!

i can tell yu that glenn has ford dear to his heart

[CowboyMatt]

They just had a statement from Lowndes on the radio and he said they aren't going to take it any further!


Some sanity at last.

[BILLFORD1]

It's all over Red Rover..... Only unfortunate part of it is the fact it will, rather than being a gold star in Ricks "Been there, Done that " CV, be remembered til he goes on the pension as remarkably similar to the Schumaker world championship at Adelaide...ie being regarded by almost everyone as "Not the Champion but the Holder of the Trophy!!". (Where he won it by backing into his only competition). There is a world of difference, whether it's V8s or scrabble !! We can all at least say of the sport, it may be a lot of things, but it sure aint boring !! :D

[00lowndes]

someone got banned????
Who got banned

Ihope R.Kelly for two year and rest of tw team for 1 year

[awawaw]

it seems the picture i put up and the post is missing.
it was a picture of rick's car with some of the signs changed

[inter]

Who got banned

Ihope R.Kelly for two year and rest of tw team for 1 year


TIC 302 (forum member)