Any chance of the Territory being done in 1/18

[The real OZ GP]

I know what it costs to produce a diecast , but I have a feeling the Territory will be Wheels Car of the Year this year and Ford are expecting it to be their savior , so how about it , could be the next big thing in Ford Australias history. Besides which, ones going to be in my drive way come September when the version I want becomes available. So a TS in Oceanic Blue would lovely please Admin.

[brchi17]

The real OZ GP, I've got to ask, what about the Ford swayed you towards it, as for mine it a real interesting vehicle. Have you ordered the AWD or 2WD ???

In the past 3 days I've seen 4 of them onthe road, so for a model that is not for sale yet, there is quite a few out there.....

cheers. :)

[Leigh]

Originally posted by brchi17
The real OZ GP, I've got to ask, what about the Ford swayed you towards it, as for mine it a real interesting vehicle. Have you ordered the AWD or 2WD ???

In the past 3 days I've seen 4 of them onthe road, so for a model that is not for sale yet, there is quite a few out there.....

cheers. :)
Our local paper has an add in them from Coffey Ford saying come and test drive/buy...

[The real OZ GP]

The process we went through was long winded to say the least , we currently have a Subaru Outback and its a great car but as the kids are growing , a bit more room would be useful, as we live interstate from both sets of parents they never have a car when they come to visit so seven seats would be great too .That left us looking at a people mover or a Crossover. Anything Korean went straight in the not interested basket , leaving Tarago, Odyssey,MPV in one corner and Kluger,Adventra and Territory in the other , Of the vans only the Odyssey appealled especially the new model coming later this year however I already have an eye for the crossover style vehicles so despite the awesome quality of the Honda it was consigned to the maybe basket .

Next up came the crossovers , first on the list was the Adventra , ohh boy what an engine , goes well, interior quality was a bit off plastic quality was low , inclinometers went out with the 1980's and I didn't like the steering the two extra seats were strictly kids only and weren't the neatest installation in the world , looking very much like an add on and despite using the same BOSCH3 black box for traction control as the Territorty, Holden decided not to make use of the stability control available so it got a little black mark for safety.
Kluger was driven on the same day , and no offence to Camry owners but it was like driving a giant Camry , smooth ,quiet but very soft in the ride , very well put together but cardigan bland inside unless you went for the GRANDE but it was fearfully expensive at over 60G. A better quality car than the Adventra but sadly soulless.The third row was much better executed than the Holden and quite tidy whan folded up
Have been watching the Territory evolve since last year and saw it properly at the Melbourne motorshow this year and just fell in love . Now having driven both rear and AWD versions they are both impressive , quiet smooth drives ,full of goodies for the money and they are a very pleasant steer , the AWD is a bit heavier in the steering but both hide the two tonne weight very well .
So it became Territory or Odyssey , now late in the process we have decided to move back to Darwin so a crossover become more attractive, especially during the wet where the extra bite of AWD makes sense especially as the AWD gets stability control over the RWD territory.So with a touch of Sadness the Oddessy was crossed off and we ordered a Territory TS (mid range model)in Offshore Blue optioned up with the third row seats , REX3 entertainment system,mats ,scuff plates, mud spats, seat back orgainisers, window shadesand a leather wheel. All up just under 56G a lot less than the Kluger or Adventra for a bigger car ,thats better built than the Holden and a better drive than the Toyota . Unfortunately Ford have decided to only release the TX and Ghia first so we have to wait until September for our TS , its going to be a long wait.

[stevelb1]

I just finished reading an interview with Geoff Polites in AMC, and boy Ford expects great things from this vehicle, and to compare it with the Holden Adventra, is really unfare to both vehicles.

From what I read the Territory is in a completely different league, not even in the same concept as the Holden Adventra.

For a vehicle that haven't really hit the streets yet, theres a lot of excited people about, lets just hope Ford has hit on a winner as they have invested huge amounts of money into this project.

[biante1478]

Originally posted by The real OZ GP
I know what it costs to produce a diecast , but I have a feeling the Territory will be Wheels Car of the Year this year ..........

Good call Oz GP, especially 9 months out. How about a prediction for the 2005 Melbourne Cup ?

[brchi17]

Originally posted by biante1478
Good call Oz GP, especially 9 months out. How about a prediction for the 2005 Melbourne Cup ?

Yes I must agree, good call.

But also I wonder how what could be classed as a large 4WD could be called the 'Car of the Year' ??? (prising open Pandora’s box….)

I wasn't surprised when I heard the news as being a regular 'Wheels' reader I knew it was one of their favourites.

They're giving this car a real heap of praise whenever it's mentioned & I hope the car is worthy of it, as well all know that some years 'Car of the Year' is not worth the paper it's written on. Let's hope this is not the case with this year's winner.

cheers. :)

[singer]

From what I understand about the Territory, the basic platform is a car, it drives like a car just the difference is the suspension make the car sit higher & you have the choice of either AWD or RWD.

Similar concept to the Subaru Liberty of the 90's only the concept, design & manufacture are all a product of Australia:) .

[Esses]

............and has been a runaway sales success for Ford. Now Wheels Car of the Year.:) All we need now is for Ford to fit a proper low-range transfer-case & a 5-speed manual & we'll have a proper home-grown 4WD.

[jager]

Wasn't the Holden Camira a "Wheels Car of the Year" winner. Strangely I haven't heard anyone asking for one of those in 1:18 ?

[thekid_600]

isnt the Camira now one of the worst Holden models known? i read once in Wheels or something. rust, bad reliability etc etc.

[toad]

The Morris 1100 and Leyland P76 were also Wheels cars of the year.

[biante1478]

I'm no fan of either car, and nor am I a fan of Wheels magazine (their anti-Ford bias is too evident for too long) but the Camira and P76 were both probably deserving winners. Both had excellence of design and intent when they were released. Subsequently they were let down by poor quality of manufacture, but Wheels magazine can't predict that at the time they give the award. Hindsight is a wonderful thing.

[timbo333]

Originally posted by biante1478
I'm no fan of either car, and nor am I a fan of Wheels magazine (their anti-Ford bias is too evident for too long) but the Camira and P76 were both probably deserving winners. Both had excellence of design and intent when they were released. Subsequently they were let down by poor quality of manufacture, but Wheels magazine can't predict that at the time they give the award. Hindsight is a wonderful thing.

Huh...:confused:

What did they test drive then........a 'virtual' model??

It sounds as though Wheels get some things REALLY wrong. I mean the P76 c'mon............what a clunker.

Sorry biante 1478 but if you reckon the P76 had excellence of design then i (or you) need a seeing eye dog:p

Timbo.

[biante1478]

Originally posted by timbo333
What did they test drive then........a 'virtual' model??


Pretty much. Its common knowledge all manufacturers provide specially prepared vehicles for magazine tests.


It sounds as though Wheels get some things REALLY wrong. I mean the P76 c'mon............what a clunker.

Sorry biante 1478 but if you reckon the P76 had excellence of design then i (or you) need a seeing eye dog

Timbo. [/B]

Timbo, can you remeber 1974(?) and the cars it was up against?
I repeat, hindsight is a wonderful thing.

Now you've got me defending the cars!!. :confused: That wasn't my intention, just that you need to consider the period when the cars were introduced, without reference to the much better cars we have today.

Now, Rover, fetch me my cane.....

[toad]

My wife used to work for advertising in Wheels & Motor mag and I can tell you catagorically that the winners are largely decided by avertising budgets & commitments for the following year.

Probably why Holden has won so many car of the yr awards.

[Footy]

Originally posted by timbo333
Huh...:

What did they test drive then........a 'virtual' model??

It sounds as though Wheels get some things REALLY wrong. I mean the P76 c'mon............what a clunker.

Sorry biante 1478 but if you reckon the P76 had excellence of design then i (or you) need a seeing eye dog:p

Timbo.
Aluminium V8
Boot big enough for a 44 gallon drum,what more from a car could you want?:cool:

[biante1478]

Originally posted by toad
Probably why Holden has won so many car of the yr awards.

Toad, interesting.
And why Ford hasn't!
Remember the XD and the "Lemon" ad by Ford?

[toad]

yes I do. It must have been a tight year for advertisers...no one to award it to. :-)

[biante1478]

Did some research to back up my point.

In January 1974, the P76 V8 was named the 1973 WHEELS Car Of The Year. "The totally new Leyland sedan emerged as a remarkably fine motor car," the citation read. "It is in the V8 version that it really shows its potential. It sets new standards for medium-sized local cars in its ride/handling/road-holding compromise, it has fine brakes, is comfortable, very roomy, practical and, with the all important V8 engine, has excellent performance and superior fuel consumption compared to the V8 opposition and the larger competitive sixes. Of course, the car is not perfect but in reaching its design objectives the P76 V8 has contributed to the engineering standards of Australian cars."

Now, what was the subject of the thread again ?

[69Mach1]

Which teritory won the car of the year, the 2wd or 4wd..

[HRT 1-2]

Originally posted by 69Mach1
Which teritory won the car of the year, the 2wd or 4wd..

Interesting point, I've always wondered about the sales figures compared with the Adventra, are they comparing AWD to AWD or total Territory sales?

[timbo333]

Originally posted by biante1478
Pretty much. Its common knowledge all manufacturers provide specially prepared vehicles for magazine tests.



Timbo, can you remeber 1974(?) and the cars it was up against?
I repeat, hindsight is a wonderful thing.

Now you've got me defending the cars!!. That wasn't my intention, just that you need to consider the period when the cars were introduced, without reference to the much better cars we have today.

Now, Rover, fetch me my cane.....



I certainly can remember 1974. The year Dad bought his Red Kingswood. 202 motor and real vinyl seats (summer was fun :( )

I was eight that year. Hindsight be dammed, the testers need seeing eye dogs then!!

I may not agree with what your saying, or indeed your opinion biante1478, but you have every right to have one!

NOT THE KINGSWOOD!

Cheers,

Timbo.

[singer]

Originally posted by HRT 1-2
Interesting point, I've always wondered about the sales figures compared with the Adventra, are they comparing AWD to AWD or total Territory sales?

The Wheels COTY has been in existence for 40 years, which makes it the longest continual car assessment competion of cars released in a calender year.

Wheels have a set of criteria which all cars are assessed against.

The cars are NOT assesed against each other rather the set of criteria which have been set before the tests commence.

Rather than make the assumption that cars are pitted against each other, I suggest you contact Wheels for a set of these criteria.

[Esses]

Originally posted by toad
The Morris 1100 and Leyland P76 were also Wheels cars of the year.

This where this thread was when I left last night - 63 hours of work finally got to me!
Why so negative, guys? Why does everyone throw up the poor old P76? As others have said, when NEW they were a great car & very innovative, as were most of BMC's products - OHC engines, 5-speed manuals & 4-speed autos - all in the 60's/early 70's spring to mind. All were let down by poor quality control & technology but I repeat, when NEW, they were great.
If you want negativity, what about the VB Commodore - THREE auto trans recalls on "Car of the Year", as I recall, but look what that car ultimately did for Holden.
It seems that when some disagree with any "COTY" award they immediately dredge up the (eventual) duds & forget all the good, great & fantastic cars that also won. Remember the furore when COTY went to a Merc? The "S" class, wasn't it? They can't win, either way.

[Esses]

Originally posted by 69Mach1
Which teritory won the car of the year, the 2wd or 4wd..

The Territory won the award, period. The fact that Ford recognised that most 4WD's never even see dirt & hence produced both 2WD & 4WD versions was recognised by Wheels (& every other motoring publication) as innovative & very clever. Not to mention brave, what if one've 'em had bombed? After the AU fiasco?
As I said, all I want now, is low-range gearing & a manual (AND the $ to buy one!) & I'll be happy.:)

[terrine]

Originally posted by Steve
.........As I said, all I want now, is low-range gearing & a manual (AND the $ to buy one!) & I'll be happy.:)

and a 5.4 litre V8

r/peter

[HRT 1-2]

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by HRT 1-2
Interesting point, I've always wondered about the sales figures compared with the Adventra, are they comparing AWD to AWD or total Territory sales?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Originally posted by singer
The Wheels COTY has been in existence for 40 years, which makes it the longest continual car assessment competion of cars released in a calender year.

Wheels have a set of criteria which all cars are assessed against.

The cars are NOT assesed against each other rather the set of criteria which have been set before the tests commence.

Rather than make the assumption that cars are pitted against each other, I suggest you contact Wheels for a set of these criteria.

I should probably re-word what I said, it didn't come out properly.

Interesting point whether it was the 2WD or AWD version which won the award (which has been aptly covered by Steve).

What I meant was this reminds me of something I've always wondered about the sales figures compared with the Adventra, are they comparing AWD to AWD or total Territory sales?

I didn't mean it to sound as though the award was based on comparison.

[brchi17]

Originally posted by toad
My wife used to work for advertising in Wheels & Motor mag and I can tell you catagorically that the winners are largely decided by avertising budgets & commitments for the following year.

Probably why Holden has won so many car of the yr awards.

This would certaintly explains some of the results of their car compararions post the release of Barra.

I just hope in years to come we don't talk of the Territory in the same breath of the P76, Camira, TP Magna etc.....

Originally posted by terrine
and a 5.4 litre V8

Apparrently the designers never considering the thought, but it is known that there are turbo versions of the DOHC 6 currently in testing for future release.

cheers. :)

[bernoo]

Originally posted by brchi17
This would certaintly explains some of the results of their car compararions post the release of Barra.

I just hope in years to come we don't talk of the Territory in the same breath of the P76, Camira, TP Magna etc.....



Apparrently the designers never considering the thought, but it is known that there are turbo versions of the DOHC 6 currently in testing for future release.

cheers. :)
Birchi17.........Wash your mouth out with soap........
:D

[HRT 1-2]

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by terrine
and a 5.4 litre V8
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally posted by brchi17


Apparrently the designers never considering the thought, but it is known that there are turbo versions of the DOHC 6 currently in testing for future release.

cheers. :)

Not the first time we've seen Ford ***** out of the V8 arena:eek:

[Robert Murphy]

Would it be strong engough to handle a V8?

Rob

[Gillick]

Seriously, what good is a V8 for normal usage. A V6 provides enough power, whether towin a caravan, or quickly passing that semi-trailer on a two way highway.

V8 = more fuel consumption + sounding like a truck. I've a mechanic working on Saabs (known for their turbo output) and other turbocharged sedans with benchmarks far surpassing V8s.

[Gillick]

The two minutes was up, before I could reread my post and attempt to edit it:

Seriously, what good is a V8 for normal usage. A V6 provides enough power, whether towing a caravan, or quickly passing that semi-trailer on a two way highway. It would be nice to have one under the bonnet, but..........................

V8 = more fuel consumption + sounding like a truck. Not to mention that 'bogan' factor, mainly young hooligans with big egos. Sorry, but that's a fact - where I grew up, travelled, and now live. I know a mechanic who's proficient on working on Saabs and other proficent, turbocahrged sedans with benchmarks far surpassing V8s.

[toad]

Originally posted by Gillick


V8 = more fuel consumption + sounding like a truck. Not to mention that 'bogan' factor, mainly young hooligans with big egos. Sorry, but that's a fact - where I grew up, travelled, and now live. I know a mechanic who's proficient on working on Saabs and other proficent, turbocahrged sedans with benchmarks far surpassing V8s.

Gillick...I have to take you to task here. For a few reasons.

All the high end manufacturers of note are increasing the use of V8 power through their range of cars...BMW, Mercedez Benz, Audi, Jaguar, Lexus. All used to be predominantly 6cyl. Its because they can get reliable, smooth torque throughout the entire rev range. The engines last longer too and are much more effective at powering todays heavier cars. The Ford Terriroty itself is an incredible 2 tonnes+ and I think would benefit greatly from V8 power.

Re the bogon factor...I don't think so. Its more to do with the car and driver that is surrounding th engine. e.g. my mum and mother in law both drive V8 powered cars...neither are bogons. But my neighboor who has a lowered WRX turbo definitely is.

Regarding sounding like a truck. You can't be serious that a Saab turbo, or any turbo 4, sounds better than a V8. If so then I would expect you are in the minority.

[Gillick]

Where I currently live, there's a part of my town where it's supposedly bogan. You never feel safe passing through there unless you drive a V8 or a bomb. Whenever you pass through there, there are Holdens + Fords galore. It's a stereotype. I know some wealthy people who own the top of the line HSVs etc, and aren't considered bogan - it's often the choice of car, primarily the older ones. Like I said, it's a stereotype, it doesn't mean everyone who owns a V8 (even the older models) are bogan. And yes, some of the Japanese try-hard cars are driven by bogans.

While I'm not a fan of Japanese cars, I always laugh when I compare the Mitsus and the American Muscle cars on "Too Fast Too Furious." I'd prefer these 'rice burners' any day. I always laugh when I see some hotshot drive by, wearing a singlet with one arm out the window, in an old Holden/Ford V8. By the way, I own an Aussie car, but it's discreet - I'm discreet.

And to end it here, the best sounding vehicle for the road is an Audi.

[bernoo]

Gillick, you can have your rice burners mate. I dont like them. My son has one. 288 rwkw bla bla bla.
There hase been more hoons on the road since low volume turbo inports started. Nearly every night you hear some idiot in a turbo do burnouts and leave black marks everywhere. Blow off valves set low th make the psssssh noise.
I went to a drift comp a couple of weeks ago. It was great. Those boys can really put on a good show. But, idiots try the same thing on public streets with out any regard for the safety of others or them selves. Tomorrow a new law starts where police can impound cars. I hope that slows them down. Dont get me wrong, some ford and holden owners try the same thing but mostly its the rice burner boys.

[singer]

Originally posted by bernoo
Gillick, you can have your rice burners mate. I dont like them. My son has one. 288 rwkw bla bla bla.
There hase been more hoons on the road since low volume turbo inports started. Nearly every night you hear some idiot in a turbo do burnouts and leave black marks everywhere. Blow off valves set low th make the psssssh noise.
I went to a drift comp a couple of weeks ago. It was great. Those boys can really put on a good show. But, idiots try the same thing on public streets with out any regard for the safety of others or them selves. Tomorrow a new law starts where police can impound cars. I hope that slows them down. Dont get me wrong, some ford and holden owners try the same thing but mostly its the rice burner boys.

The impounding of cars for the type of offences you describe has been in place in NSW & ACT for quite some time.

You still get a fringe element who will flout the law, what ever the penalty is

[Andrew]

Originally posted by bernoo
Gillick, you can have your rice burners mate. I dont like them. My son has one. 288 rwkw bla bla bla.
There hase been more hoons on the road since low volume turbo inports started. Nearly every night you hear some idiot in a turbo do burnouts and leave black marks everywhere. Blow off valves set low th make the psssssh noise.
Dont get me wrong, some ford and holden owners try the same thing but mostly its the rice burner boys.

I can see this thread getting a bit heated...

In sleepy old Tassie (bless its soul), we are only just getting the ricers in any meaningful numbers, but they would be outnumbered by the Aussie-car bogan 4 to 1. And the most aggressive and dangerous on the roads here are the aforesaid bogan. Easily. Tassie now has 'anti-hooning' laws where your car can be impounded, and repeat offences can see your car be repossessed.

I congratulate Ford and their Territory for producing a car that is so useful and so obviously focussed for the Australian market. It is not something I will personally buy now, or ever, but I recognise that for a significant number of Australians (and their families) it is a sensible and useable car for Aussie conditions.

Mind you, I'll take the 1991 joint Wheels car of the year - Honda's magnificent NSX...

[terrine]

Originally posted by brchi17
.....Apparrently the designers never considering the thought, but it is known that there are turbo versions of the DOHC 6 currently in testing for future release.
cheers. :)

HUMBUG....we dont want a turbo we want a V8

May 2003...."Mr Polites has confirmed that the new cross-over Territory model will be released in early 2004 without a V8 option.

"We can't do everything, we have a very good six-cylinder engine," he said. The Barra V8 will not fit into the engine bay of the Territory with all the ancillaries that go along with an all-wheel drive drivetrain."

BEESWAX

AUGUST 2004..."The CAPA 'Terror-tory' made its debut with it's supercharged, 5.4 Litre V8 engine producing 400kW. To our knowledge this is the only V8 powered Territory in existence"

see this piccy (http://www.capa.com.au/pics/news_territory_04.jpg )

see there website if you are interested

www.capa.com.au

r/peter

[HRT 1-2]

Originally posted by Gillick
Where I currently live, there's a part of my town where it's supposedly bogan. You never feel safe passing through there unless you drive a V8 or a bomb. Whenever you pass through there, there are Holdens + Fords galore. It's a stereotype. I know some wealthy people who own the top of the line HSVs etc, and aren't considered bogan - it's often the choice of car, primarily the older ones. Like I said, it's a stereotype, it doesn't mean everyone who owns a V8 (even the older models) are bogan. And yes, some of the Japanese try-hard cars are driven by bogans.

While I'm not a fan of Japanese cars, I always laugh when I compare the Mitsus and the American Muscle cars on "Too Fast Too Furious." I'd prefer these 'rice burners' any day. I always laugh when I see some hotshot drive by, wearing a singlet with one arm out the window, in an old Holden/Ford V8. By the way, I own an Aussie car, but it's discreet - I'm discreet.

And to end it here, the best sounding vehicle for the road is an Audi.

What the??????

Did you mean to say "town" or planet?

[brchi17]

Originally posted by Gillick
Seriously, what good is a V8 for normal usage. A V6 provides enough power, whether towin a caravan, or quickly passing that semi-trailer on a two way highway.

V8 = more fuel consumption + sounding like a truck. I've a mechanic working on Saabs (known for their turbo output) and other turbocharged sedans with benchmarks far surpassing V8s.

Gillick, I'm also going to take a large swing at the Gillick anti V8 bandwagon....:D

As a Gen III owner I can quite easily say that the V8 does not always equal greater fuel consumption & a truck like sound.

For example, my old EL Falcon (6 cylinder auto) running on LPG used to average 6km/Lt & my VY SV8 averages 8km/Lt, so it's in fact it's actually more fuel efficient than a 6 on simular driving conditions.

As for sounding like a truck, if you can find a truck that sounds like a Gen III, please tell me as I'm sure there would be plenty of buyers !!!

I know you'll understand that this is nothing personal, just a differing of opinions. Sure there are some that think V8’s are dinosaurs & others that just love turbo’s, etc….. & vice versa. I think it’s really comes down to personal taste & what you’ve grown up on & love.

I for one not only love the sound of a big boar V8, but also have a passionate love for the unique sound of the WRX’s turbo boxer 4.

Sure you may not need the power of a V8, but some of us like to, just because we can. The same can also be said for turbocharged engines as well and really when is enough power, enough :D !!!

cheers.

[Leigh]

Keep it fair Brad...:p

You can not compare fuel consumption in cars from two vastly different periods...

How does the Gen3's fuel consumption compare to the Ecotec or Alloytec V6? or for that matter, Ford's CURRENT in-line 6?

You are also comparing Auto versus Manual...another factor in fuel consumption.

Cheers:D

[HRT 1-2]

Well said both Toad and brchi17!

As I've always said when people ask "why do you need a V8" my standard answer is:

If you need to ask the question, you wont understand the answer!!!!

[coops]

Originally posted by Gillick

V8 = more fuel consumption + sounding like a truck. Not to mention that 'bogan' factor, mainly young hooligans with big egos.

I read a comparo of the Terry v Adventra and the Ford had worse fuel consumption figures.

What about V8 drivers in 7 series BMWs and S Class Mercs. You call them bogans too?

Weird how no one has critised the VT for being COTY. Now those are a real piece of ****. Its probably the most significant Aussie car so far, but no one knew that in 1997/8.

[brchi17]

Originally posted by lcfp2297
Keep it fair Brad...:p

You can not compare fuel consumption in cars from two vastly different periods...

Very true Leigh & I'm sure you'll understand that it was done mealy to show that a V8 can be fuel efficient, when compare to a simular (yet different powered engine) sized vehicle.

By the same token it is also unfair to simply label things without facts as was done in the first instance.

Actually I can compare my V8 figures to that of a VZ which I drove around in Tassie a couple of weeks ago. In just over 2000km's it averaged 10km/Lt, which I thought was pretty impressive considering I did give it a bit of a hard time & enjoyed every bit of it :D

While we’re comparing simular items the ole SV8 is just as fuel efficient as my brothers VX S-pack (non-supercharged) in which he struggles to get 500km from a tank, which is when the SV8 gets a drink & on average takes around 60lt (remembering it has a 75lt tank).

cheers.

[Kenseth17]

Originally posted by Steve
This where this thread was when I left last night - 63 hours of work finally got to me!
Why so negative, guys? Why does everyone throw up the poor old P76? As others have said, when NEW they were a great car & very innovative, as were most of BMC's products - OHC engines, 5-speed manuals & 4-speed autos - all in the 60's/early 70's spring to mind. All were let down by poor quality control & technology but I repeat, when NEW, they were great.
If you want negativity, what about the VB Commodore - THREE auto trans recalls on "Car of the Year", as I recall, but look what that car ultimately did for Holden.
It seems that when some disagree with any "COTY" award they immediately dredge up the (eventual) duds & forget all the good, great & fantastic cars that also won. Remember the furore when COTY went to a Merc? The "S" class, wasn't it? They can't win, either way.

Well said Steve!
Congratulations to Ford on their award winning Territory.They seem to be making ground into 'other' areas now, something they have been critcised on before...... :)

[69Mach1]

Originally posted by coops
Weird how no one has critised the VT for being COTY. Now those are a real piece of ****. Its probably the most significant Aussie car so far, but no one knew that in 1997/8.

Don' knock the VT's , i'm sure the AU wasn't much of a challenge.

VT - Car of the Year
VT - 2 times Bathurst winner
VT - 3 times Touring car Champ
VT - No 1 selling car 98 , 99 , 00

[coops]

Originally posted by 69Mach1
Don' knock the VT's , i'm sure the AU wasn't much of a challenge.

VT - Car of the Year
VT - 2 times Bathurst winner
VT - 3 times Touring car Champ
VT - No 1 selling car 98 , 99 , 00

And those four points have nothing to do on reflecting how good the actual road going/showroom car is.

I don't think the AU was around when the VT was launched, so I doubt they would have been in the same COTY. I'm not too sure who else was in there with the VT, but I am confident a poor low quality car should not have got it. Gotta remeber whos arses Wheels are sucking tho eh?:cool:

[Leigh]

Originally posted by coops
And those four points have nothing to do on reflecting how good the actual road going/showroom car is.

I don't think the AU was around when the VT was launched, so I doubt they would have been in the same COTY. I'm not too sure who else was in there with the VT, but I am confident a poor low quality car should not have got it. Gotta remeber whos arses Wheels are sucking tho eh?:cool:
Did you purchase a Friday build?

I'm really puzzled where your comments are coming from.

The VT was streets ahead of the VS it replaced, or the EL from the opposition camp...

[brchi17]

Originally posted by coops
....I don't think the AU was around when the VT was launched......

You are correct.

As Leigh said it was up against the EL for the greater part of a year before the AU was released & to be honest, compared to the VT the EL was simply not up to it.

That said VT series II certainly had some substantial advance in both build quality & refinement.

cheers. :)

[ferrari fan]

Horsepower can only be made by feeding plenty carbo/air mixture to an engine.
Lotsa HP equals lotsa Fuel.
never mind if it is a single,4/6/8 cil.
Not using the HP pedal means not a lot of demand for Fuel/air.
With the traffic and the fuel price a 4 cil makes sense to tinker arround inthe city.
Watch for the scooters population boom in the coming years:mad:

[ferrari fan]

Originally posted by ferrari fan
Horsepower can only be made by feeding plenty carbo/air mixture to an engine.
Lotsa HP equals lotsa Fuel.
never mind if it is a single,4/6/8 cil.
Not using the HP pedal means not a lot of demand for Fuel/air.
With the traffic and the fuel price a 4 cil makes sense to tinker arround inthe city.
Watch for the scooters population boom in the coming years:mad:

A 4wd has to be a diesel if you are serious re outback trips.
A V8 other than used as a Terrace tractor is useless.
In the outback there is always diesel.

[Kenseth17]

Originally posted by ferrari fan
A 4wd has to be a diesel if you are serious re outback trips.
A V8 other than used as a Terrace tractor is useless.
In the outback there is always diesel.

Have to agree with you there FF.I had a Landcruiser that I travelled around the country in and it was WAY more economical than anything else in comparison.The diesel engines 'look after themselves' that bit more and even with diesel at a higher price per litre, it would still pay to have one economically.

[wayno]

I'm surprised the diesel car has taken so long to catch on in Australia. Diesel sales make up a big part of vehicle sales in Europe. With better quality diesel (low sulphur) starting to become available in Australia now I think the diesel car might be the next big thing.
I have a brother living in the UK and he says some of them are even pretty good to drive!

[singer]

Originally posted by wayno
I'm surprised the diesel car has taken so long to catch on in Australia. Diesel sales make up a big part of vehicle sales in Europe. With better quality diesel (low sulphur) starting to become available in Australia now I think the diesel car might be the next big thing.
I have a brother living in the UK and he says some of them are even pretty good to drive!

I drive a diesel (Coaster Bus) every day and & its done 1,196,000 kms. Engine still going strong though the body work is detriorating slowly especially with the kids picking away at the interior.

[terrine]

we had a nissan patrol 4.2 lt TURBO diesel wagon before our last 4X4 and it was possibly the best 4X4 i ever drove
you know why?
it drove like a petrol

r/peter

[Gillick]

Originally posted by toad
Gillick...I have to take you to task here. For a few reasons.

All the high end manufacturers of note are increasing the use of V8 power through their range of cars...BMW, Mercedez Benz, Audi, Jaguar, Lexus. All used to be predominantly 6cyl.


I realize this, but the above mentioned are in a superior class of their own......

think primary school vs college.....

[Gillick]

Originally posted by Andrew
In sleepy old Tassie (bless its soul), we are only just getting the ricers in any meaningful numbers, but they would be outnumbered by the Aussie-car bogan 4 to 1. And the most aggressive and dangerous on the roads here are the aforesaid bogan.


Sorry to put you quote out of context, but I need it to highlight my sentiment. Although I've never been to Tasmania, I concur with your thoughts where I've travelled/lived.

Just the other day on the highway, a white Vs Commodore pulled up beside me while overtaking in an 80km zone (I was going 80km) the passenger mouthed me, they sped up a little, passenger threw rubbish out the window, they sped up to atleast 110, threw more rubbish out to motorists they overtook, and gave the finger a number of times. When I caught up to them (three cars back) as we approached road works, a MAN in the back seat stuck his head out the rear window and embraced the wind, much like a dog would, before somehow getting high enough to flash a moonie....Oh, and some had a mullet.

Like I said before, it is a sterotype.......but a damn good one.

[HRT 1-2]

Originally posted by Gillick
Sorry to put you quote out of context, but I need it to highlight my sentiment. Although I've never been to Tasmania, I concur with your thoughts where I've travelled/lived.

Just the other day on the highway, a white Vs Commodore pulled up beside me while overtaking in an 80km zone (I was going 80km) the passenger mouthed me, they sped up a little, passenger threw rubbish out the window, they sped up to atleast 110, threw more rubbish out to motorists they overtook, and gave the finger a number of times. When I caught up to them (three cars back) as we approached road works, a MAN in the back seat stuck his head out the rear window and embraced the wind, much like a dog would, before somehow getting high enough to flash a moonie....Oh, and some had a mullet.

Like I said before, it is a sterotype.......but a damn good one.

What this has to do with the size and orientation of an engine is beyond me, I must be a bogan:rolleyes:

[brchi17]

Originally posted by Gillick
.....Just the other day on the highway, a white Vs Commodore pulled up beside me while overtaking in an 80km zone (I was going 80km) the passenger mouthed me, they sped up a little, passenger threw rubbish out the window, they sped up to atleast 110, threw more rubbish out to motorists they overtook.....

If you got the rego plate of the above mentioned vehicle feel free to ring 1800 352 555 & if you're prepared to sign a stat dec. stating that they did actually throw rubbish out of the window, then they'll receive a little present (I think it’s something like $250.00) in the mail from the dept of revenue for their violation.....

cheers. :)