2nd lot of VL Walkinshaw Road Cars

[loste_treasures]

Hello all,

This post might start some interesting discussions......

Can anyone advise (especially ADMIN) when the remainder of the 12,000 VL Group A Walkinshaws are to be sold to the general public???

Seems like 6,000 of these things didnt sell and are going to be hitting the streets very soon....

Its seems that there are certain people here in Melbourne who are getting ready for the 2nd batch with one major retailer actually having an order form sent to them from Biante.

I didnt think this was possible (imagine the poor collectors who have forked out upwards of $250.00 for these things) but i had to try and hear this with my own ears and yes, it is true. The retail price will be $145.00. The certicate will be exactly the same and you will NOT be able to tell if the model is from the 1st batch or second batch. COA numbers will not be 6000-12000......

Whats next to come back in stock?? Imagine the re-sale value dropping for a Track Red XY, or a White Single/Double mirror XY.

Whats everyone think about this situation and what will ADMIN have as a response???

[Aussiecollector]

Have not heard but, on another matter,

How is it that you list cars as RARE in your ebay auctions for the Skaife and Ritter cars for example and have them valued at $25 to $30 dollars when I can walk into any of my regular haunts here in Sydney and buy up to 20 of them straight of the open shelves.

Glenn

[loste_treasures]

Hi Glen,

Thats a good point your making. I define RARE when something is not easily found in any particular city, state, country etc.....

If you find something in plentuful quantities in Sydney (as an example) will not mean the same applies in Melbourne, Adelaide, Brisbane, USA, CANADA, SINGAPORE (just some of the countries the minicars end up)......will it?

I know for a FACT that some of the Minicars you use as an example are NOT sold in the same quantities in some northern cities making them rarer to obtain. In some countries, they are simply non existant.

And on another matter........

I thought this post was regarding the VL Walkinshaw?

:p

[Aussiecollector]

Gees, touched a nerve did I.

[Highlander]

I guess its hard to comment Loste Treasures without a confirmation from Biante first. but in all fairness it was always listed as a 12000 release,and what ever is payed for a model privatley is between the two parties concerned. Hope it is cofirmed soon by Biante either way.

[BATHURSTFAN]

I think the word RARE is used too frequently on these auction sites.

RARE means uncommon or unusual.

I don't care how Loste puts it, those models are released in virtually the same quantity as most others.

Those models are out there and made in their thousands, just because they are sold out or hard to obtain does not make them RARE, either way they are still out there for sale or not.

Of course there are the exceptions such as the white twin mirror.

[Aussiecollector]

My comments regarding the issue of rare are in relation to the ebay auctions run by loste.

To be rare one would assume that it was a very limited original edition which is sold out and only comes up now and then.

I don't think that the 1/64th range of cars that are everywhere,(ie retail / auction sites / swap meets) no matter what state you are in could be taken seriously as being rare, its a simple ploy used by ebay dealers looking to make a quick buck out of the
un-suspecting novice buyer.

Its like the dealers / profiteer resellers using the old sales line
" can anyone help me i need to buy one of these cheap as my kid wants one so bad" They but it from some helpful person and a day later its on ebay for double the selling price.

Next thing you will try and tell me that you believe that Mattel's Schumacher cars are limited editions (25,000) released world wide.

[loste_treasures]

Touched a nerve??? Nah. Actually i dont mind talking about this. After all it also makes interesting reading, doesnt it??

No matter how you look at it, if a particular item is in short supply then yes i consider that to be 'rare'. As ive stated previously not all of these items are in plentyfull quantities as aussiecollector states.

It is a widely known fact that in some of the northern states these items are very hard (or non existant) to find.

Over half the items i sell, including the other items i have (not only Biante stuff) end up going overseas. Can anyone explain why then is that? Maybe some of our overseas posters can tell us how many stores stock minicars overseas??

And if they are in large quantities as stated then why do so many buyers buy these things on the internet?

But getting back to the reason for this post.......

My understanding is that all 12,000 VL Walkinshaws were sold and never to be produced again. Im led to beleive that this particular run did not do as well as hoped and therefore led to the 'sold out' tag being placed on this run.

Yes, i do hope Biante can deny what im stating. If im wrong than i sincerely apologise. But if im right then what will it do to their credibility???

Apart from collecting something that is unique, we also collect something that is a limited run and will naturally appreciate in value over time. If you deny this then your only kidding yourself. If you think that you only collect these items for the sake of it then find me someone who is willing to sell me a track red Xy for retail. Put it another way. The reason why so many models appreciate is because they are a limited run. Once they are sold they are gone. Isnt this one of Biante's sale pitch?

Anyway, all we can do now is wait to hear from Biante. As ive said i hope Biante can clarify this for us here in Melbourne.

[BATHURSTFAN]

1) If its hard to obtain because its popular does not make it rare, EG If the Brock minicar sold out and the Max Wilson car did not, the Brock car would not be rare as they were both built in similar numbers. To me a rare item is something built in very low numbers.

2) I live in one of those "northern states" and I find all Biante models available, I've yet to hear a dealer say he only got 3 Brock minicars and 12 Max Wilson cars, sure some sell out quicker than others.

3) Just because a model is not stocked overseas does not make it rare. I bought a NASCAR from the States and because its not available here I would not say it is rare because you can still get it overseas.

4) Its obvious why you sell models to overseas buyers, because they are not available in the shops overseas and the internet is the only means they have to buy such models.

5) Like Aussiecollector said, some people on the internet are unaware of what they are buying or don't do enough research

[chups]

i was looking for the brock minicar here in perth and i couldnt fing it anywere, so to me i would consider finding this model a rare find. what are the chances fo walking into any house in your street (except your own) and finding a biante minicar? i would say it would be rare to find someone with one..

but anyway, i bought my walkinshaw from a retailer about a year after they totally sold out, and he had got one in (i dont know where from) and he was selling it retail price. i think this retailer would know the value of this car and would add a little to the price as it is hard to find these days but he didnt. is biante slowly releasing these one at a time to different retailers to sell?

also the 'sold out' tag on the web site only means it is sold out from the web sites stock like any other store. if biante still have the other 6000 doesnt mean the web site would sell them.

[admin]

The reason for the "new" run of VL Walkinshaws is quite simple.
As we wre using a new manufacturer and it was the first car they had made for us, we only issued an order for about 75% of the run. If there was a delivery/quality/shipping/ any other problem, then the fix would not have been so financially devestating.
We have now issued a buy order for the balance upon repeated approaches from the stores and collectors and the last run will be delivered late this year.
All the previous batch were sold out. The numbering will continue the sequence from where the first batch ran out up to the designated 12,000.

[loste_treasures]

Originally posted by admin
The reason for the "new" run of VL Walkinshaws is quite simple.
As we wre using a new manufacturer and it was the first car they had made for us, we only issued an order for about 75% of the run. If there was a delivery/quality/shipping/ any other problem, then the fix would not have been so financially devestating.
We have now issued a buy order for the balance upon repeated approaches from the stores and collectors and the last run will be delivered late this year.
All the previous batch were sold out. The numbering will continue the sequence from where the first batch ran out up to the designated 12,000.

There you have it folks !!!!!!!!!

How many more models fall in the same situation???? Serious collectors in Melbourne have known about this for over 1 month.

There has been no mention of this (officially) from Biante until now!!! Why has this been the case?? Why has it taken a post like this to confirm this?

I feel real sorry for the collectors who actually paid over double the retail price for this model. Im sure if they had actually known about this then they would have waited.

There were similar roumours regarding the Sierra..but of course this isnt the same....is it??

Im sorry Biante, im a dedicated diecast collector with over 200 models (a substantial amount are biante) but i cant help but feel like your trying to pull the wool over our eyes......

:confused:

[admin]

Yes! There you have it. You asked the question and got an honest answer! I have explained the reasoning for it..what benefit do you think Biante achieves by "rip off merchants" charging mad prices for our models?
I also feel sorry for collectors who pay over the odds for anything, especially brand new stock straight out of the current shipment, and there are a heap of stores and collectors who will tell you my feelings on that!!
If we were making numbers 12001 to whatever, crucify me, but we are making the full run as indicated back in 2000. Not one extra car over what we stated originally.
Just as an aside, I believe that through this forum, club newsletters, bulletins etc, we give the collector more information and personal time than all the others put together. But we havent got time to personally tell everyone every single thing we are doing every minute of the day and neither should we..it's quite frankly no ones business but ours.
So loste-treasures there you have it. It would have been easier to say"we just found 2000 Walkinshaws when we moved warehouse", but that would have been lying and I don't operate that way.

[ferrari fan]

Lost treasure you surely are not serious about that ridiculous statement !
You cannot be a dedicated collector in the sense of the word collecting.
You should try to get a real life and stand up to your trouble and strife instead .
some of you so called diecastcollectors just s*** me with your attitude and your demands, if you all keep it up this will surely be the end of a forum like this. keep this in mind you bunch of whinging worms.

[loste_treasures]

hey ferrari......

im dissapointed with your attitude as well........

it took a post like this to finally get Biante to let us know what is REALLY happening with the VL.

what you think this 'news' is not worth spreading around to other biante collectors?

so you think its ok for collectors to pay over $250.00 for the VL and not tell them to wait until the second batch comes out???

Im sorry ferrari, i think biante collectors need to know about this type of news.....

and by the way, i was prepared to cop some flack from some collectors.....for obvious reasons.......

[loste_treasures]

Originally posted by admin
Yes! There you have it. You asked the question and got an honest answer! I have explained the reasoning for it..what benefit do you think Biante achieves by "rip off merchants" charging mad prices for our models?
I also feel sorry for collectors who pay over the odds for anything, especially brand new stock straight out of the current shipment, and there are a heap of stores and collectors who will tell you my feelings on that!!
If we were making numbers 12001 to whatever, crucify me, but we are making the full run as indicated back in 2000. Not one extra car over what we stated originally.
Just as an aside, I believe that through this forum, club newsletters, bulletins etc, we give the collector more information and personal time than all the others put together. But we havent got time to personally tell everyone every single thing we are doing every minute of the day and neither should we..it's quite frankly no ones business but ours.
So loste-treasures there you have it. It would have been easier to say"we just found 2000 Walkinshaws when we moved warehouse", but that would have been lying and I don't operate that way.

i really appreciate you taking the time to answer my post.....

however, can you understand how this all looks? why wasnt there a mention of this when the model was first released?

at least if there was a mention of this then collectors would not think that there was anything wrong with what you were doing now.

i mean, i can understand that there can be problems with supply and demand. its all a part of doing business.....

however when theres no mention of this and it takes a post like this to get you to state what is happening with the VL then what do you expect us to think?

can you state that this has not happened to any other model in your range????

can you please advise us exactly how many more VL's are to be released to make up the numbers?

can you please state what was the last number to be produced in the 1st batch and what is the first number to be produced in the 2nd batch??

[ferrari fan]

It is not the actual facts but more the way it is socalled demanded
(to diclose every single bit at any given time by the manufacturer, in this case Biante, Try this in any other firm and the demand will not get any where.
This website is being run as a selfregulating democracy ,so to speak< and again the biggest enemy of a democracy is democracy it self.
Just purchase what ever you want or can afford and stop demanding this and that from the source and furthermore DO NOT INSULT the host that makes everything possible on this site that makes collecting AUSSIE cars and almost every other model car that comes in this country! I.E. do not ****in the bed you are laying in!:mad:
I cannot make it any clearer
I did miss out on the roadcarmodel and have had the pleasure to have owned a real one but was not prepared to pay extra!for the model
My life has not changed one bit even without the car in my collection missing!

[Oh Five]

Thanks lost treasures (and Admin), now that i know about this , i might try and get one..
Cheers.
P.s ferrari fan, im sure admin can fight his own battles, he doesnt need you to shadow him all the time.

[loste_treasures]

hey ferrari,

lets try and recap what has happened with the VL so far...

lets see......

- make a particular series of 12,000 (in theory).

- model sells out. cant buy them anymore for retail. people who missed out are forced to buy them off the collectors market.

- prices go up in the meantime. internet auctions have them for upwards of $250.00

- years later find out that thousands where not actually made and are going to be released later in the year but dont tell anyone until someone finds out about it.

- some collectors say "oh well. it doesnt matter if i paid over double for this model when i could have had it for retail if i had known and waited".

I mean c'mon ferrari. and you reckon this isnt worth posting???? You tell to someone who missed out the 1st time and has bought one since.....

Oh, and you were one of the collectors i had in mind when i said i knew id be getting some flack over this. Admin is a big boy! and he should be able to defend his actions. He is doing a good job of it so far.......

So, you think collectors like Oh Five should go and buy one now at $250.00> or wait until he can get one at retail???

[Aussiecollector]

The reason he is so upset is that he has just seen his margin drop on any that he is trying to sell.

Anyone who is buying as a collector would not be that worried, you take it on the chin and an extra 2000 will sell pretty wellover the next 12 months and the overall market price will come back up in the next couple of years. Its only the quick bucks that will suffer.

Its not all that different to what minichamps are doing to collectors worldwide with the re-release of some cars. Its got some people ruffulled and others like me saying ok I will now buy that car at a good price instead of the got to have it ebay price.

This guy (L-T) is one of the people that orders cars at 3pm and has them on the ebay sites by 5pm like the Brock VX @$200.00.

FF - Take a pill

Its a conspiracy, wheres scully and mulder?

Glenn

By the way admin did you find anything good in the warehouse move like some MP 4 /12 Mclarens in 1/18th.

[Three_o_seven]

Lets simplify this........12,000 VL's to be built.
HAVE 12,000 BEEN BUILT?......if this question answers no that means more will be built to fill the original quota.
HOW HARD IS IT TO UNDERSTAND!
If you have been overcharged by a hungry collector deal with it.....life goes on.

P.S To be honest I think people should count themselves lucky the remainder are being released due to the nit picking i read in the original forums about this model....grow up....please.

This record is getting cracked

[loste_treasures]

forgive me for being STUPID and sounding like a BROKEN RECORD but....

dont you get it? you obviously dont, do you???

has this happened to any other particular model?

is there anything else that has not been 'completed' in that particular run?

do we take it for gospel that if a COA states 8000, 5000 etc... that all of em have been made or are they going to be released over a 2, 4, 5, 10, 20 year period to make up the numbers??

should we panic when an item is allegedly stated as sold out or should we just wait until they come in back in stock??

cheez.........

is that too much to ask?

[Three_o_seven]

sounds like you've got a few you can't unload.

A person colllecting for the sake of collecting would have no problems with this ....... Biante isnt here solely to provide you with a source of income.

ONE OF BIANTES RULES ARE .......ONE PER CUSTOMER

If you choose to take advantage of other people by buying 2, 3, 4 of a particular model purely to make a profit one day its going to bite you on the bum...........hope it hurts.

happy collecting

[loste_treasures]

for the record.....

i have only got ONE VL Walkinshaw. i have no vested interest in this model. what i do have a vested interest is in my other more valued items.

i do not want them to decrease in value because of some mix up in their orderding/manufacturing system.....

[chups]

ok, this is getting a bit too serious.

i see where loste_treasures is coming from.

i waited for my walkinshaw, i wasnt going to pay more than $150 for it, and if it hadnt of come up then i wouldnt of got it, this new lot gives collectors like me the chance to get their model at retail price. if i had of paid over $200 for my model then yes i would be extremely annoyed that they wernt all sold out. also this means that if they dont all sell out in the first 6 months (they probably will) then i can build my 1:18 walkinshaw limo :)

also were the last 2000 built in the original run but not sent or will they be re-built and if so will they be the exact same ir have little 'problems' fixed up?

[Three_o_seven]

If you only have one of these models why are you so upset? 12,000 units were to be built, 12,000 units will be built. If a collector wanted to buy one off an auction site he would assume that 12,000 units exist, due to the number listed on the certificate (12,000).

Therefore due to common sense the value of this item will remain the same in the future after the full 12,000 has been released. If you got caught in between the releases ...........bad luck.

At the end of the day there will be 12,000 and I'm sure they will appreciate over time.........but if ur a serious collector you won't want to sell it anyway.

Actually I'm happy because it gives me the opportunity to buy one at a reasonable price.

[perry]

The VL is the only model ive ever bought on the second hand market. I paid $300 for it because i wanted to complete my collection, and i was under the impression that they had all sold out.

I understand i paid a reasonable fee to obtain the model, and it was my decision to pay that price. The cost is not the issue.

The issue is that we were not informed that more were on the way. It would not have been hard for Biante to list on its website that more VL's are due "later on".

I would have waited for the next batch, rather than buy on the second hand market, had i been informed.



Furthermore:
Admin said "If there was a delivery/quality/shipping/ any other problem, then the fix would not have been so financially devestating. "
If that is the sole reason, why was the VL Grice Percy released before the next batch of Silver VL's?? Has the Grice/Percy car been released in full?? What about the toranas??

Are there any other biante models that have not been fully released??

[ducksguts]

I have a mate who had an unfortunate household mishap which resluted in one very munted up VL Walkinshaw... He was pretty devastated and desperate to replace it, he will be happy when he finds out he can get one again at retail.

I can see the point Loste was trying to put across.
hmmm might even buy myself a Walky now too... now that i know i can get one at retail .

:rolleyes:

[sboland]

I can see loste_treasures point on this,and I think its a fair call.
Id be pretty p@ssed at paying extra for a model which I thought was sold out, but actually it wasnt.I know also its none of my business as well as to what Biante does,and Im not going to get in a war over words about it will anyone,but wouldnt it be proper for Biante to let its collectors know of such things as this.Instead of listing an item as "sold out" how about "production yet to be finalised" or something similar.
Cheers.

[ZORAK]

Guys get a clue will you? It is 2,000 - 3,000 models out of 12,000. I bet that in less than 6 months the price will be back to where it is now....

Perry I feel for you as I almost paid $220 for one a few weeks back but mate, buy I know you are not in this to make a profit, but buy one at retail, store it for a few months, prices will rise again and you can pass it back into the market for what you paid for the first one. You aren't making a profit, simply turning over old stock at the same price you paid for it.

If Biante were talking about releasing 10,000 of the 12,000 that would be a different story but in the big picture it is not a huge deal and some of the collectors that missed out back then or have come on the scene now will actually benefit from it.

I believe that Biante acted out of the genuine interest of the collector with their intent to ensure that the quality of the product was up to standard and the fact that they had a sold out sign and not a "more to come later" sign is pretty easy to excuse.

You guys try to run a "normal" business that fights to survive on a daily basis, let alone a company like Biante that has grown so fast that, I am sure they have trouble coming to terms with all the logistics. Biante, I congratulate you in what you do, the quality of models you produce, the amount of diversity you offer and the time you give to us collectors.

If the rest of you really don't like this how about you form a protest and not buy any more Biante models.... that way you can't get "burned" and the cars will be easier to get for the guys that really appreciate them.

Z!